Daughter won't seek help for mental illness.

Hi @Hummingbird,

Welcome to the SANE Forums! We really appreciate your contribution and hope that you are able to connect with others who share similar experiences to get some tips and strategies for working through all that’s going on for you. We’ll try our best to make sure you feel right at home here!

It sounds like you are going through so much right now, and have been for a long time. But from what you’ve said, it sounds like you are trying your absolute best for your daughter and grandchild, despite the difficulties you are facing. It can be really hard to try to help someone when they are unwilling to seek help, and this is something many of our members here on the forums have experience with, so hopefully they have some wisdom to share with you. Perhaps @olmate, @Adlin, @Camelia, @coffeegirl, @BeHappy, @Alessandra1992 have some advice or can share some of their experiences?

Again, welcome to the forums and we hope you are able to find the support and help you need here.

All the best,

supernova.

Hi @Hummingbird

It sounds like you're stuck between a rock and a hard place. You want to set boundaries for yourself, but you also want the best for your grandchild and don't want to compromise their safety. It is clearly having a heavy toll on you.

While you did mention she has never been aggressive towards her child, your safety is important too. In the short term is easier and safer to not engage when she's displaying aggression, as you have done, but my concern is what will happen in the long term. If she sees this behaviour goes unchallenged, it's unlikely it's going to get better.

The situation becomes so much more complex when a child is involved. I can see on one hand you don't want the child to be taken away from your daughter, but also you have concern for your grand daughters safety.

There is support out there for you. Have you reached out to any services to get support for yourself? Carers are often eligible for free counselling and support. Depending on which state you're in, it's worth searching for your state based Carers organisation and your local ARAFMI (which is also known as Mind in Vic and Helping Minds in WA). At the very least, you are eligible for 10 free sessions through Medicare, which you can access by going to your GP. You deserve help and assistance too - so please utelize these. Not only is it an opportunity to look after yourself, but they may also have advice and suggestions on services for your daughter.

You are not alone in your experience - there are many members who are struggling with their home life. One person who comes to mind is @artee who started a discussion about enforcing boundaries here

Please keep using this Forum as a resource too - you can get a lot of support through this community.

Take care

Hi @Hummingbird,

The situation at your home sound tense and tiring for you.

May I ask if you know if your daughter is still using ice? I obiviously can't be be certain, but it seems like her behaviours may be related to using ice. Is she sleeping much? Has there been weight gain or loss?

If she is using, it might explain some of her behaviour. Depending on weather she she is drug affected or not, he behaviour could be aggressive, energetic or tired and depressed.

Did she get a diagnosis? In terms of drug use and mental illness, it can be a bit like an issue of chicken and egg - what came first. Ice can induce psychosis.

While it could also be a mental health issue, it might be helpful to talk to a drug and alcohol counsellor. You can speak to once for free online, or call one from Counselling Online.

Regardless if she is using or not, it sounds like things cannot remain how they are. You are walking on eggshells. Yet, I wonder, at the same time, if there is part of your daughter who has learned that she can get what she wants by behaving a certain way? While she is living there, with a roof over her head, what incentive does she have to address her needs? Not that I'm saying that you should kick her out, but perhaps setting up some boundaries about what is ok and not ok. As @NikNik pointed out, safety is important. And feeling threatened or worried about aggressive behaviour is not ok.

Anyhoo, I hope this helps a little. Looking forward to hearing from you.

BeHappy

Hi NikNik, Thank you for your response to my novel.

I know I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place and that's what makes things so hard. I just can't see a solution or an end to this situation.

My main concern is for my granddaughter. She is such a beautiful natured child and it kills me just thinking about what she has to put up with, or what her future holds. This is why I do not engage when she displays anger as it only provokes her and lasts much longer.

I think about the long term constantly, and know I am enabling her behaviour by not challenging her when she is aggressive, but at this stage she has never attempted to hit out at me,(If it ever got to the stage of her hitting out , I would defiantly call the police ) she just yells and glares at me and blames me for something of little or no relevance. Eg: not practicing controlled crying on her as a baby, is why she cries as an adult...I separated from her dad is why she ended up on drugs 11 years later!! She has never accepted blame of any kind, everything is and has been someone else's fault and I guess some of it is my fault as I have always pulled her out of trouble or fixed it, but I have tried and tried but now realise I can't fix this one on my own...

Boundries, I have tried.... She does exactly as she pleases, and if I challenge her on those boundaries she starts the accusations, threats , yelling and banging things around. I'm not sure if it it her mental health or just her defiant nature, I can ask her a hundred times not to do something and if she is in the mood she won't and if she's not, she just does it anyway..

I think I am at the stage where I will seek some form of counselling, as my own mental health is withering. I have always been " the calm one" "solution finder". I didnt know I had such anger in me until she came to live with me, and I hate that feeling, it just destroys your soul.

I will continue to use this forum, and have read @artee post ( poor lady) and it does help to know that others have similar issues. Although I wish for their sake they didn't .

Thank you for the resources, I will check them out.

Hi @Hummingbird

@BeHappy raised some good questions about your daughter's diagnosis and substance use.

I know many other carers here will empathise with you - as you mentioned @artee has been discussing boundaries a lot with other members. In this discussion initiated by @hopeandsupport there's a real push for carers to seek out their own supports and ensure they are engaging in self care.

In terms of boundaries, I guess what I meant was your own personal boundaries. It's hard to enforce boundaries and consequences on others. The boundaries I refer to are the boundaries you create for yourself to maintain balance and protect yourself from the behavior or demands of others.

Sometimes it's useful to consider your boundary and the actions you can take for yourself if those boundaries are crossed. An extreme example is if your daughter was to physically lash out at you, you would call the police, as you flagged. But there are other boundaries you can put in place to look after yourself.

This discussion started by @Appleblossom about boundaries contains lots of tips and resources offered by other members such as @Former-Member , @Kiera80 , @pjc11 and others. It might be worth checking those out.

Do any other members have advice about personal boundaries that have worked for them?

Would it be fair to say that as a mother you are both afraid of her, but also for her? With the added complication of there being a little one you also feel you need to nurture and protect?

Would it also be fair to say the behaviour is "controlling"? Do you feel like if you breathed in you will be lashed out at because you should have breathed out? No matter what you say or do, it's going to be "wrong" and her lashing out is somehow justified (in her own opinion)?

Do you feel trapped into not reacting or avoiding the reactions because you as a person will be torn to shreds, not only to yourself, but to others (by her)? And your need to put up with it in order to make sure she and the baby are ok? Do you feel yourself often trying to fix the situation or try to find the solution?

Are you made to somehow feel guilt you did something wrong, didnt do enough, or something is yours to fix, even if it wasnt you who did it?

Have you ever been in a relationship with an abuser? Because that's pretty much how it goes. If it's another adult, we can walk out, walk away, start again. But when its one of your own kids the whole mother thing makes us still want to fix it, make it ok, make sure everyone is safe and happy and...

And we feel like we cant just take a walk and leave the whole sad sorry mess to them. As a mother, we want to make it better.

I'm here because I dont know how to a) make it better b) keep myself safe and c) stop taking the blame for things I actually didnt do, and realistically if it was anyone else but one of my children I'd be taking a hard line.

I sometimes wonder if attacking someone they know won't attack them back, is their way of avoiding facing the reality of situations. Their solution is its something we did that caused every single thing, or they invent it up if it never existed? And they can sling anything at us and we wont harm them back. I dont know. I'm with you in I don't know land.

My name LTS stands for Life Time Sentence. Not because I am in prison, but it feels like I might as well be because for the life of me I cant see or find any way to fix this, change this, undo the damage done, stop more damage being done. It feels like the great unfixable forever nightmare you never wake up from.

Does your daughter also threaten you if you "dare" speak to anyone about her? Mine even went so far as to threaten me over even speaking to someone she doesn't know. Apparently she will somehow know and find out, and god help what i am in for then. But she will never let anyone else see those kinds of things and pretends to be the exact opposite. To discredit me if I dare tell anyone.

Eggshells doesnt even begin to describe it. You lose you lose or you lose big time. And just like an ex partner abuser that just wont/cant stay out of your life and leave you alone, it seems she will never give up.

If anyone comes up with an un-mother pill to reverse those instincts that kick in the moment we give birth to them, let me know where I can get some. You can change the locks. But you cant stop them pursuing you and ruining your life and relationships if they are determined to. And as a mother its almost impossible to fight back or defend yourself how you would with any other person.

With my daughter, stated boundaries are treated like you didnt speak. She ruthlessly pursues her own agenda and if the conversation deviates from where she wants it going, god help you. Delusions rule supreme and she will not allow anything said that deviates from or may throw doubt on her concocted realities and desired outcomes. In her opinion she makes the boundaries and nobody else gets a say in it. And she seems to get some real kick out of lying and convincing people and proving over and over that she controls what people think, and do, and (shudder) she appears to be very very good at it.

If anyone here has suggestions besides have a face change operation, change name and address and move to the north pole in some obscure village where she can no longer affect me or my life, or even suggestions on how to undo some of the damage she has already done, I'm listening. Because I have no idea what to do with this.

OMG you are me !! Every word you wrote is my life to a tee. Yes whatever I say is wrong and usually starts her blaming and cursing.. Just now she said the xmas present she bought for her sister was expensive and took too much of her time to shop for it, I suggested she to go to a different shop and buy a similar one for half the price.. Well...that started her ranting and throwing the bag on my bed with " you take it back I've already spent an hour shopping" .. ( I looked after the baby whilst she was shopping)

Been in a relationship with an abuser.. Yes, my daughter... She has always blamed, accused and cussed and yelled whenever something didn't go her way, and she is right to some extent...it is my fault... My fault that I would sacrifice my own sanity to fix her mess, pay her debts and give in to her demands so her life could be easier than mine was as a child. . It is my fault that she now expects that to happen at 31 years old.

i don't know how to fix this mess either and I can't foresee it getting any better, if anything it will only get worse..if she wasn't my child I would have walked away years ago..

You wonder if they attack us because they know we won't retaliate.. I think so, as she also can switch off her verbal attacks when others are present, and act as if she is kind and empathetic. No one else hears the invented accusations an and misconstrued blame.

I have stopped trying to make it better and am now in touch with mental health, the next time she starts throwing things or kicks a hole in my wall or screams and rants on my front lawn, I will be calling them to assist and assess her.

Keep myself safe... I have a lock on my bedroom door and retreat to my room when things are too stressful.. That in itself makes her angry as ' how dare I lock myself in my room for some peace, how dare I not make myself available to listen to her, what a bad grandmother I am to not be available at all times to look after the baby while she goes to the shop for the 10th time in one day..

i have never let her know I speak with anyone about my home life or her. Although I get accused of it when I'm texting a friend, which most of the time is general chit chat about an recipe or my job.

It is true you lose and you lose no matter what you do. I have tried the kind and caring , the hard, the sad mum but nothing works for long. So now I am the lifeless mum who speaks to her only to reply with to the point answers. There was a time when she was drug addicted and I had tried to get her to leave her drug addicted and dealer boyfriend to come home, she did but returned a few days later, got high and had an altercation with police that attracted channel nine news. I refused to speak with her so she took a cocktail of prescription drugs and was taken to hospital, then proceeded to tell everyone that she tried to commit suicide as I wouldn't speak to her her.. I found the hospital she was in and Drs told me she had not taken enough of anything to be life threatening.. I did and still do believe that it was purely a manipulation attempt as it was the first time in her life that I had refused her anything.

Boundries, I hear you, there is only boundaries for others in this household.. Her delusions are also supreme, and God help anyone who challenges them. This is why we don't most of the time. My main concern is for the baby now, and if challenged she will scream and cuss in front of the baby which scares her. So I just walk away and go to my room,I want to take the baby with me but that would cause her to lash out at me and put both baby and me at risk....

If if you find a nice modest house in a village in the North Pole, I will join you, I am prepared to give up my nice home, new car and good job to be paroled from my life sentence..

If you find an unmother pill , please share.

Stay safe.

I am going throught this right now. yesterday and today have been dreadful. My son ,31, has suffered from an undiagnosed mental illness for years. For ages we thought he had BPD, but his depression,paranoia and agression have increased markedly. He has a beautiful 7 year old daughter,on access, and this week end has been able to care for her. His paranoia towards me has become unbearable and his verbal and emotional abuse very difficult to sustain.

He will not seek help from a psychiatrist because he fears she will be removed from him. His former partner is also suffering from mental illness and has many convictions. he has been using drugs, denies its ice but his brain is so screwed. I think it is ice.

He accused me of stealing his daughter a few hours ago.The only reason she has been with us her grandparents is because he said he could not care for her.His daughter has been asking why he is not with her and I explained that he has not been well and is depressed.I have just had an call with him attacking me over this.

Yesterday my husband and I asked if we could call the CAT team hesaid yes but he would not disclose how he was feeling to them I have seen him in the past pull himself together and act normally. and then attempt suicide. He will not get help because he does not trust them , or anyone really

I have been setting limits and refusing to give him money for drugs. He is not usoing consistenty but my husband will give him money intermittenly.

I am 69 years old and I need some peace. Although reasonable fit I am exhausted, it has impacted negatively on our marriage.He takes every opportunity to take me down. This is not how I expected to spend my retirement years. I am ready to leave if I could only find somewhere to go.

EDIT: Sorry Leigh I didnt see your post when I was typing. Didnt mean to be rude and seemingly ignore/exclude you. Try telling your son you are legally adopting his child unless he gets clean and successfully gets off and stays off the drugs. Drugs and kids should not go together. Then its his choice. And if he chooses the drugs then he has to admit to himself that his child matters less than his addiction. Takes the blaming you for it all out of the equation. Good luck.

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And so much of what you said is my life. Well this is the first good thing. Knowing its not only me.

The discrediting thing (switch to an angel in front of others) is one of the things that keeps us trapped I think. They go out of their way to make sure nobody will believe us? The control thing again. Classic abuser.

The maybe good news is that now I am opening up, a few people have said things that got me searching in an area I probably wouldnt have looked. Personality disorder (not BPD but full on PD). And one thing hit the nail right on the head for the first time. Narcissistic personality disorder apparently has this "defeat someone else" factor and take joy in seeing the perceived competition suffering. The win. The ruthless pursuit of the what they want. The lack of care or empathy AND constant and unrelenting manipulation of others that gives them a kick.

I had always thought narcissists were selfish and self centred and self indulgent. I didnt know about the taking something away from others aspect and the habitual manipulation. I feel I can hang a label on it at last that fits. (jump for joy moment).

The bad news is. Now I have stopped being "silent" about the things she has done (and is still doing) the fact that I kept my mouth shut for 17 years is working against me. I'm getting "those looks" from people who knew us like a) bad mother syndrome and b) are you making this up?

But now I am speaking I am not going to stop now and go back to being made to feel I cant talk about what she does. If I lose friends then tuff. You shouldnt be made to feel afraid to tell the truth.

And I feel like I can breathe at last, despite the adverse reactions. Maybe I'm ready to face the flack and those threats that have been hurled at me for years. Maybe I will (or have laready decided to) lose her forever. Maybe waking up that she is 32 not 13 and no its not my fault or my job. At that age she outght to be pulling her weight in my opinion not still playing this stupid game and competition.

It's her choice. But I can choose too. And I have chosen to stick with the truth and wherever that takes me it takes me.

I'll keep an eye on real estate on the north pole. I reckon I/we might be needing it. lol Good thing I never threw out my polar boots? They might be coming in handy after all.

(insert emoticon for determined face)