Why care about suiciders?

Thanks for the reply @Lemonjuice. It certainly sounds like there are good reasons for the erosion of your hope. Your circumstances do sound hard. Certainly where there is abuse and unvalued work as a carer at home then your road back to health (and hope) is made much harder by that. Your struggles with your mental health must also be distressing and exhausting.

But the part of you that says 'I probably won't suicide' deserves recognition too and that thought needs honoring and nurturing. I would imagine that it's connected in some way to your studies which is an act of hope. Even if progress is slow, it's happening, and it's preparing you for a better future.

One of the few ways I agree with Freud is in the importance of love and work. (Although health is pretty important too). But not the narrow culturally-sanctioned view of love and work. The version we make movies about. He means activities and relationships that are rewarding and have purpose and meaning for us. There are as many different versions of this as there are people. Getting older gets very little good press but one of the things that often happens is that we work out what version of love and work actually suit us and are realistic for us.

So what fuels hope at 54 is different from what fuels it at 24. But I think the version of love and work that we can create in our 50’s and beyond can be more authentic and rewarding. Are you studies part of that? Are you studying something that reflects your interests?

I don't know if any of this helps Lemonjuice. I don't wish to make light of your struggles at all. But I'm trying to say that the part of you that chooses to keep living deserves some hope. And re-thinking the love and work that you want, and being open to it existing in the future, can be part of that.

Not the response I was expecting @Lemonjuice but it made me smile 🙂 I'm a psychologist. I think you were really under-selling your studies if a Phd is in your future and you're being courted as a supervisee!

Ok...so this is a repost because my post got pulled due to me mentioning the name of two (of the three) helplines where I have experienced being hung up on. Given I've mentioned the names of helplines about a bazillion times before when describing negative experiences with them, I have no idea why it was deemed to be against the guidelines on this particular occassion. Oh well, here is the post again with the names of those two helplines removed...

@Former-Member

I really like that you made the point here that suicide can be viewed as the result of insufficient treatment and support being available to ease the immense pain that drives the urge to suicide. I super struggle with the fact that there is that lack of support. For example, it is beyond my comprehension that helplines have hung up on me when I have called in extreme crisis, desperate for help to keep on keeping on. I believe that someone who is seeking help to stay alive deserves all the help in the world. Sometimes that help can be as simple as just staying on the end of the phone. I can guarantee that if I was on the end of the phone to someone who was in extreme suicidal distress, there is no way in the world I would hang up on them - no matter how chaotic they may be!

I also found it interesting that you stated the guidelines prevent discussion of the method, but that the rest is valuable and welcome. I am sure you are aware that I had a post removed from this thread on Friday night because it apparently breached the guidelines despite the fact it wasn't even remotely related to methods of suicide. I am working super super super hard to wait to discuss this with @NikNik rather than venting about it here. However, it did strike me as odd that you said discussion around suicide is generally welcome, when I had a post removed for expressing my values around suicide. I found it particularly odd given that I've stated this same value many times before, had other Forumites agree that they share the value, and had moderators "like" the posts in which I state the value. Indeed I've had whole conversations about this value with some Forumites (e.g. @CheerBear) without it ever having been an issue before. I feel very frustrated that the post was deleted, but happily for me, I have so much other stuff going on right now, my brain simply doesn't have room to deal with that one. I will just keep practicing waiting for NikNik (good job me!).

You're right @Phoenix_Rising - it is a little more nuanced than simply not allowing the discussion of method. The forums aim to create a space for people to share their reality, no matter how painful, but to also encourage help-seeking and recovery. Sometimes we ask for changes to posts where we are concerned that this balance hasn't been struck. That happens across all topics not just suicide.

But where it can be really tricky is the balance sometimes needs to shift based on a few different factors such as feedback we're receiving. So what might appear to be moderation inconsistency is actually the result of us responding to new situations and information. That's why we email you to request the changes and do our best to explain our reasons.

So the discussion about suicide is definitely welcome but sometimes we need to work together to make it as safe and helpful as possible.

I did my training when CBT was the very dominant paradigm @Lemonjuice. These days I try to blend it with some ACT and mindfulness but it's hard to shake entirely I currently have a supervisor with a psychodymanic approach which I really enjoy. It's refreshing!