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A strange dream and it's meaning...

A strange dream and it's meaning...

Hi everyone,

a few nights ago I had a dream in which I learnt my friend died. In the dream I was a bit surprised that she had died, but I wasn't sad about it, in fact I felt nothing much at all. She is relatively young and healthy - so I didn't expect she would go and die; that's all.

In the dream, I decide that I'll write a nice tribute to her on facebook. I don't even really feel like I want to do that much, but I know I have to be seen to do something socially acceptable, so that is what I decide I must do.

What a strange dream!! Me in super-uncaring mode!

In reality, my friend is perfectly fine. I have had a very long history of somewhat uncomfortable interactions with her that culminated in a tense argument over 10 years ago. Since then, we have not exactly been close, although we go through all the motions of being good to each other and sharing news of our private lives.

Recently, I had the thought that I'm very glad she doesn't call me often, as I don't like the way she pumps me for advice and then rings off. The conversation seems quite one-sided, at times.

Anyone else out there ever had a dream like this? Such a strange dream!!

137 replies

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In response to: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

It's great to have found you too @Former-Member Such an interesting, honest, wonderful post to which I can relate a lot to. Well said 💕

In response to: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

@Former-Member I don't think it is possible to not feel hurt or not to feel righteous indignation if someone whom we have been good to betrays or hurts us. But we move on because we know we can hold our heads up high as our integrity is intact. And knowing that those few who are loyal would never do that to us - and that they are the ones in our life who truly matters. And when someone is cruel for no reason and hard of heart - they are not happy people whom have the problem. It's the cruel ones, the betrayers loss and downfall.

The giving expecting nothing in return (having no motive) is love in action. Not so much a life skill but an inner growth created by choices made from the heart 💕

In response to: Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Hi @Former-Member

I agree that harmful actions by others is indicative of suffering within them. Particularly deliberate harm of others. And I certainly agree that being able to rise above hurt is easier if we can feel we have the high moral ground - our integrity is intact.

However I now believe that, whilst 'love in action' may be a nice explanation for not expecting kindness in return for kindness and loyalty in return for loyalty etc, putting it into practice is a lot more complicated than just 'being a loving person'. But then, I am currently investigating the hypothesis that life itself is a skill that can be learnt.

Sorry. Bit hippie sounding.

Yes. It is inner growth. But not growth that just naturally occurs through life. If the conditions and circumstances don't arise for us where we come to understand things differently, then righteous indignation or envy or hurt can arise in us uninvited. We have no choice over what arises. Only in how we deal with what arises. So there's skills in learning to deal with difficult emotions that can be learnt. But deep inner core beliefs of which we are unconscious and which are conditioned mean that 'choice' in the moment of reaction is not always available.

Look at poor old Donald Trump who has to lash out on Twitter the second after a tiny wound to his narcissistic ego!

To have that 'choice', we need to have really unpacked and examined a zillion personal beliefs and possibly turned our thinking upside down completely in order to 'choose' to respond instead of react. For example, I might not be too disappointed and angry when a used car salesman, say, turns out to have sold me a lemon. But I might be shocked and then furious and hurt if my own sister betrays me. Is that a useful illustration of my point? Perhaps not. I dunno.

Anyway, yes, it would be love in action but a huge, deep, all -pervasive love that can be the result of either conditioning or application to training the mind to view things differently and learning to recognise the righteous indignation when it arises and THEN choose to respond differently. Thus, a skill. The more we can do that, the less and less frequently the anger will arise in the first place over a lifetime of practice.

we all have the capacity for cruelty, and some are habitually cruel due to a lack of empathy. Many, sadly. I can see how those people deserve our compassion, but I reckon I'd struggle to have compassion for my rapist or my daughter's murderer like some people do. Much as I'd like to. I think it wasn't a 'choice' on their part, but a whole complex of beliefs and ways of looking at the world that got them there. Get me?

A mentally ill homeless person abused me in the street the other day. Compassion for his suffering was not the first reaction that arose! But my recovery time was quicker. So I'm learning. I think my learning is coming about by daily 'study' and practice of loving kindness. And one day the first reaction to arise will be compassion for him.

In response to: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...


@OverTheEdge wrote:

Hi @Sahara

@Sahara human nature can lean towards selfishness in a lot of us. Sounds like you have been a true friend but your friends and family aren't as selfless. If you are doing all I suggested and you can't rely on these people at your darkest times - if it were me I would begin to shift my time and energy on making new acquaintances and friends. It's not good enough @Sahara in my humble opinion and I dont blame you for feeling disillusioned with them. If you were that good a friend with me I would give back to you tenfold. I never take anyone for granted and appreciate true offers of friendship. As the latter is rare and not easy to find admittedly. But it's out there. And The fact that you have been so giving - you are undoubtedly the person I described and expressed admiration for in my last post. Don't lose you because others can't recognise your beauty. I really like you and I never say anything I don't mean. You are good to chat with. A gift.


@Former-Member, thanks for saying that you like me.... that means a lot to me. I also like you! You are always compassionate and kind to everyone here on Sane Forums, not just to me.

I know what you mean by shifting my energy towards making new friends. I think that is a great idea, and one that I would have followed up on a lot sooner if I hadn't had such a tumultuous past 12 months.

One of the things that came up for me in the counselling sessions that I had was that I am a person who goes through life feeling "emotionally deprived". I learnt this through Schema Therapy. I didn't even realise that I felt emotionally deprived until it was uncovered in therapy! It's a deep seated, subconscious belief that I hold on to and have done so all my life without even knowing it or recognising it. Apparently, most people are like this; they hold onto certain core beliefs without ever being aware that they are doing so. You have to unearth these beliefs to see what they are.

So while I might go through life seeming reasonably happy and well-adjusted (when I am not suffering from depression), I do harbour this belief..... I feel very deeply and with certainty that my emotional needs will never be met. Ever.

It's sad but true. The best I can do is be aware of this belief and try and challenge it, when-ever I can.

(This belief very likely comes from the childhood that I had.)

So, with my friends, I am probably always looking for evidence that they will not and cannot meet my emotional needs. That is why I stated in a former post, when describing how it seemed to me that my friends are not there for me; "Or it could be my mind twisting things around".

My friendships have been intense but patchy. With each friendship, I could list plenty of occasions where I have felt close to and loved and supported by them. But I could also list occasions where I have felt brushed aside and dismissed. These occasions, where I felt 'dismissed; each, unfortunately left deep impressions on me. To the point where I just wait and think that I am very likely to be brushed aside again and there is absolutely nothing I can do to stop it happening.

So I go through friendships feeling insecure and watchful. I always feel that I could be dismissed and forgotten at the drop of a hat..... and for me, that is akin to disaster. It effects me very badly, to the point where I am starting to cry now.

But (deep breath) I know that in reality, I will not curl up and cease to exist if a friendship ends. I will survive and go on to find other friends... my personal history is testament to this. In my life, I have always been very independent and just relied on myself and my own judgement to carry me through. While I have certainly wanted friends, while I've been friendless, I've still gone out and done things and achieved stuff.

I suppose that for me, dealing with all this, it leads me to become very introspective and to be endlessly examining my friendships and focusing on the bad bits. It's a bit of a downer.

Hey, that sounds great about your German friend! How did you two meet?

And you volunteer friends.... you make a great point- that volunteers you know already would make great candidates for friends, as they are giving people. None of my current friends volunteer, as far as I know. Not really. If fact, they are quite self-centered people... if you look at their lifestyles.

In response to: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Hi @Former-Member,

thanks for writing. I know what you mean about having a bit of an 'addiction' to the forums... sometimes I feel the same as you and I purposely try and spend time outdoors, away from the Internet for this reason.

I think I have a bit of an addictive personality, which doesn't help!

The reason I like to keep posting is that I use the forums as a journaling exercise; that is, it's primarily for my own good... it really helps me to gain clarity on issues and to examine the way I think. I like to read back over some of my former posts to see if my ideas have changed or to try and identify any kind of development or personal progress.

Look, if some of my posts are helping others, then that is great, but if they are not, then that's ok, too. Not everyone can relate to me and that's fine.

Yes, I agree, there are some very challenging individuals that are posting here on Sane Forums, at times. Please do not take their comments personally or if they seem to ignore you, do not take it to heart. Absolutely, some people are stuck in a victim mentality and this will delay their recovery, in my (uneducated) opinion.

I know a lot of people who get sick with MI struggle to see their illness as just that - an illness. They seem to believe that their suffering is unique and special and that no-one could ever understand it or could ever possibly help them.

If fact, when the human brain goes haywire, it goes off the rails in remarkably similar ways.... all of which can be treated. There is nothing particularly 'special' about having an MI. Other than MI having a stigma attached to it, that is!

However, when you are stuck in the midst of MI, it feels so awful that it's hard to believe that you can be treated and you can make a recovery. For some people they will never believe it and it prevents them form taking the first step in seeking treatment or it prevents then from continuing treatment when they find they will not be instantly 'cured'.

It's a bit like cancer, you know. There are very effective treatments for cancer out there... some types of cancer can be more or less cured, if discovered early. But treatment takes time and it can be very unpleasant. You have to commit to it. You have to do a lot of things.... rest, stay out of the sun, eat when you are not hungry, take laxatives, the list goes on. These things in themselves can get you down. Because your life is not 'normal' anymore. But with cancer, at least you get heaps of sympathy!! (one of my relatives has cancer... but I am in no way an expert on it.)

@Former-Member, feel free to stay away from the people who you think might have a victim mentality. You have no obligation to them what-so-ever on this forum or in real life. You primary obligation is to yourself- nurture yourself and seek out those whose company you can enjoy.

You are always welcome to post here, as little or as often as you like. X

In response to: Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

That Schema Therapy sounds amazing. Only just heard of it

In response to: Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

In response to: Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

@Former-Member - Love in action in my life experience simply is the giving or helping others without a motive. Unconditionally without judgment. The inner peace derived sustains. No pay off from someone else needed or sought as the nature of true love itself is selfless. And like attracts like. So those who also know how to love will respond positively. Those who are mostly self-centred won't as they are not givers.

Those who hurt in return chose not to love which is out of our control, but our choice to do so isnt. Neither is our reaction. All personal choices as we have free will. Rightful Indignation resulting when a wrong has occurred and has wounded is also love in action; as it seeks to protect oneself or others by attempting to make a wrong right (justice), by the right avenues (not going down to the offenders level). It protects (puts dangerous offenders in jail etc). So if a salesman rips us off or we have have been personally violated in any form - we have rights my friend. Love does not endure abuse in any shape or form. It does not sanction it or feel compassion for a harmful act that "leaves mental scars" on the victims. That's misplaced compassion. It seeks rightful justice to be rid of harmful actions from society as its destroys what is good. Tough love then comes into being. It's a battle.

The problem is today too much of what harms is seen as okay and allowed. And mental scars/illness will rise as a result. No matter how modern a society deems itself by its own self proclaimed ideals - the truth is the truth and what is wrong always will hurt. Values are declining.....

People can forgive their offender - that is letting the anger and hate go so it does not take their goodness and peace liberating themselves. That is not saying the harm done is okay and the offenders do not have to face the consequences of their actions. We all face those consequences eventually. I would only feel compassion for those whom harmed if they were truly remorseful and genuinely seek to change. In other words if they want genuinely to be forgiven or not. We can't offer forgiveness to those who don't want it and are quite happy in keeping up with harmful acts. That is quite a misconception of what love is. It isn't soft minded. It's logical, fair and just.

But I will always let go of any hate (even self hate), revenge, bitterness and rage etc that seeks to take my goodness and peace. The offender wins that way as that destroys a person taking their innocence/goodness/integrity. Without that a person is empty. That is why it's never a win situation to go down to the offenders level - that's what they want. I have learnt that. And that's when we move from being a victim to perpetrator. As we all have been victims to some degree. All can state that - even the worse offenders. So it's no excuse to harm.

Seeking rightful justice is acting in the welfare of self and others which is love. Turning a blind eye with excuses is supporting the harmful action.

But it is inevitable that mental scars occur for the victim that they may nevertheless be free of completely but have to learn to carry and cope with in a positive way so they can move forward. I have personally experienced that. My compassion always lies with the victim foremost and upmost. The other can learn from the sting of consequences.

Feeling compassion for those who enjoy hurting others whom are unremorseful??? No fear - that would be saying their harmful actions are okay and that is not love - that's foolishness as it's leaving open another chance to do harm. That would be feeding bad behaviour to become monsterous and further harm would result. Love is wise and justice is part of it; common sense prevails. Lock them up where they can hurt no one and throw away the key. Or call out the bad behaviour demanding respect. That's love in action, stopping the harm in its tracks - it is also called consequences for actions.

Love in action is not hard for some but can be harder for others whom seek self or have never experienced it themselves and dont know any better or what it is. That's where role models are invaluable. We are all different, in different circumstances and at different stages of growth. And it depends how much we want love or if we have the insight to know it to nurture the values to obtain it. We all have been selfish at some stage as that is human nature and that struggle can make it difficult. Also difficult when we are have been traumatised and our spirits are dampened or trust becomes an issue (been there).

With the latter it then comes down to the choice of whether to allow this to take the good out of oneselves, to take our peace, our life or not. Or fight through that dark phase wanting better by being better. And that can incurr very different individual circumstances. Nothing is black or white except "that love is what it is and lovelessness is what it is". Truth never changes.

But when we choose to move beyond that selfishness is when inner growth occurs and inner peace begins. We all can have different reasons for that - wanting to give back, protecting another/s or because we feel deeply about a cause that we give just to seek the welfare of those involved (refugees, climate change, animal rights - that's the end result and payoff they desire which is selfless); to have purpose and meaning or the big one - through empathy and compassion (the latter being a higher love which can only be created through suffering - being able to relate to ones pain). That's been my life experience and that is all I can speak from.

You are right - a higher peaceful loving state is never easy to obtain especially when others/powerful organisations who do not have the same values seek to harm (been there, look at Ann Franks diary, she never lost her sense of self, faith or goodness); it takes "self sacrifice" to reach it; and the easy way out, the easy road, which so many look for including myself at times in my life, will never reach it. They will just go around and around coming back to the same emptiness.

When negative emotions get in the way such as anger, revenge, fear, low self esteem, selfishness, greed, indifference, ongoing grief, depression, grudges, envy, jealousy hate, doubt, guilt, bitterness, distrust, self indulgence, power etc that prevents true love in action we have to work through them. And that's an individual choice from their free will to So or not. Programming the mind to me can be a form of brainwashing that seeks to control and override free will. Love doesn't work like that. But we can "will love" (do the right thing even though "we don't feel like doing it, but do so because it's right). Then there is no regrets. But to me love only means something and is genuine and real when given freely from the heart in my experience. That's why I believe we have free will - we choose who we want to be and that defines our destiny.

We are all very individual and we are all at different stages of that growth. But until we do work on these growth inhibitors that's when we can get stuck "or lost" as until we do growth gets stunted; we get stuck, can't move forward and can feel empty/troubled.

Yes, it is something that comes with inner growth overtime and how fast we grow does depend on the insight and values we have that will guide our choices and actions along our journey. If we are strong in ourselves and values no circumstance will override that as if it does they were never heartfelt and sincere in the first place. Hence putting love to the test.

Thank you for the interesting discussion 💕

In response to: Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...


Sahara wrote:

I know what you mean by shifting my energy towards making new friends. I think that is a great idea.

Hey, that sounds great about your German friend! How did you two meet?

And you volunteer friends.... you make a great point- that volunteers you know already would make great candidates for friends, as they are giving people. None of my current friends volunteer, as far as I know. Not really. If fact, they are quite self-centered people... if you look at their lifestyles.(end of quote)


There is your problem @Sahara - you will never have your needs met by self-centred people as they are not givers (read my last post). But through broadening your horizons and meeting different people whose actions prove they are "capable" of meeting those needs and refocus your energy getting to know them.

Its a good thing you have realised you harbour an unhealthy belief system about yourself. My daughter needs to recognise her low self esteem and also challenge this. That's a good start @Sahara.

My grandmother was German and so I sought out my roots. I meant my friend through a penpal friendship that started about 20 years ago and just flourished. We lead different lives but share the same values and just clicked. We have a very close bond. I will fly over to meet her one day - we are arranging to meet up in Rome.

In response to: Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Re: A strange dream and it's meaning...

Wow. Interesting discussion on 'what is love for you?'. Fascinating take on love and growth.

just one thing. Training the mind as I refer to it, has nothing to do with programming or brainwashing!! Methods for brainwashing are pretty straightforward as are 'programming' such as in cultish organisations. Most of the methods are covert. And I can assure you that psychopathic and narcissistic abuse is similar. Covert psychological and emotional manipulation of others.

mind training in the context I mean is the disciplined ongoing practice of deep contemplation, meditation and concentration that brings unconscious beliefs and schemas, like @Sahara mentioned to conscious awareness. It is not wishful thinking or trying to convince oneself of infinite abundance or professional success or other things that the self-help gurus of the 80s might have tried to convince us of.

Mind training is just like body training. Exercising the full consciousness every day to wake up and be aware.

I agree that suffering of the kind people on this forum have experienced can bring tremendous insight wisdom and growth. I also believe victims of abuse can develop an unconscious unhealthy core belief that 'this (abuse) is what love is', and so develop a victim mentality which makes escape, awareness and growth incredibly difficult.

it is great that you can always let go of hate etc. Surely that is what most of us want to do. But not all of us can find a way to do that. And not all offenders DO suffer the consequences of their actions. Justice of either the legal or natural kind just doesn't happen as often as our cultural myths pretend. The truth might well be the truth and wrong will always hurt but Truth doesn't always win! (this bit of our debate looks like going mainstream what with the whole 'fake news' thing and liars calling other people liars!)

calling out offenders of bad behaviours most often harms the whistleblower or the victim, in my observation. Not always a wise choice for self-preservation. Plus we are big on victim blaming in this culture. I think of poor Monica Lewinsky living with being shamed for her own predation for twenty years without justice.

having said all the above, I am basically in agreement with most of your philosophy!

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