Do we all simply have to help each other?

Hello @Historylover and welcome to the Sane forums. There is so much truth in what you have said in your post.

Your final sentence particularly resonated with me .... "Personally, I think everyone has forgotten how to care - genuinely care." Although I am unsure if people have actually forgotten how to care, or if they simply do not have the time to care. Life is a real rat-race for so many people .. A sign of modern times I guess. They barely have the time to take breath, let alone genuinely care for others.

But having said that .... I think you will find that there are many members here who really do care for their fellow MI sufferers. When it comes to peer support ... people here genuinely understand what we all go through in our everyday battles with mental illness. And in understanding, comes empathy and caring.

So its lovely to have you here, and I hope you feel comfortable to continue to share your thoughts, your frustrations and your own unique story when you feel ready to do so. Well done for opening your own support thread, where other members will be able to support you specifically. However please do not think you are restricted to just this thread. You are very welcome to post to any other existing thread if you would like to. There are also many social type threads where members gather, and its a good way to get to know a few other members. If you need any assistance in navigating your way around the forums ... please do not hesitate to ask. Just hit reply and post your questions.

I hope to see you around the forums as you become more familiar and confident. Again ... welcome.

Emelia 🌸

Hi@Historylover ,

To say we're on the same page feels like a gross understatement. More like we're on the same word.

I was rather naieve in believing that turning to the mental health system - you know, that industry that exists to help those who are struggling - would actually get me out of my crisis. Then after 8 miserable years, I learned that they never intended to help me at all with my problems because it's "the golden rule" of therapy to not actually help a patient, or even give them meaningful advice about how to solve their problem(s).

Truth is, all I ever really needed was a friend who was willing to actually help me, rather then just sit back and judge me. That was something I never really had. So I figured that going to therapy would be just like "buying" a friend, who would do all the things that one could expect a real friend would do to help you get the life you wanted. Sadly not.

As you say, this is the sort of "help" mechanism we are in desparate need of in this country. People need real help, not just "talking to", "listening to", or god forbid medication and/or electroshock. The sort of help that would be free and abundant in a society full of people who truly cared about one another.

You're not alone in your feelings about the mental health system @chibam . It is in desperate need of reform and changes that lift the voices of those with lived experience. I'm a therapist and I agree that there's some serious issues with how things are at present. Some of what you've posted is also things I've come across in my work and study, as well as my experiences as a client, so I just wanted to weigh in.

Advice-giving in therapy largely is discouraged because it assumes that the therapist knows better than the client about the client's own life. It also could be very wrong advice, which would destroy the therapeutic relationship. The goal of therapy is (by-and-large) not to fix the client's issues but to help the client develop skills, find tools, and build up their resources so that they can then solve their own problems - i.e. when therapy ends, and new problems arise, the client doesn't need to go back to therapy to tackle these new problems.

A therapy relationship is also unfortunately not a friendship, and nor should it be. Again, the goal is to empower the client to be able to tackle their problems, resolve negative self-talk, and give them the ability to then leave the therapeutic relationship. It can be really tricky, especially if you have a really great connection with your therapist. But if you are friends, then it can easily become co-dependent and very unhealthy. Having said that, I still think it's important that some of the qualities inherent in friendships are also in a therapy relationship - trust, genuine care, and authentic connection.

Finally, I know that medication is a topic that folks have very differing opinions about - truth is that some people are prescribed medication who shouldn't be, but then others find that medication is the best thing that they've found to help them. It depends on the meds, the person, the circumstances.

The reason I wanted to weigh in is just to let you know that there are many, many therapists who agree with you that the mental health system is deeply flawed and needs serious reform. But it is still really important to remember that therapy works. What works is different for everyone, and whether or not a particular type of therapy or treatment will be effective often comes down to the relationship between client and therapist. I also thought you might find it useful to have some context about some of the tendencies you highlighted about how therapy unfolds.

Most importantly, we all have to hold onto hope that things can change, both within ourselves and within the system we work. I know I am always trying to create better experiences for those I work with, and hope that every small change will keep moving us towards the future you have described.

Hey there

Sounds like you're proposing an entirely new paradigm for existence? Wild. I'm in.

Fist bump

Anon4

The message is in the medium. Therapy by design is a "you're suffering and I can help" setup. Where's the mutual vulnerability and the opportunity to feel more like a human with things to offer and less like a "consumer" whose brain is either "broken" or in "trauma" (by the broken and traumatised world's definition)? Therapy saves lives but fails to examine itself as a process except to insist that it's a wonderful thing when done right. And on it goes.

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@Jynx wrote:

Advice-giving in therapy largely is discouraged because it assumes that the therapist knows better than the client about the client's own life.

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Perhaps. But I would be more inclined to believe that it assumes the therapist knows more about the world then the client does, and how to get around in it.

I agree that therapists shouldn't be telling patients what they should want (something that my monstrous therapist wasn't shy about doing, BTW), but they should be willing, if able, to tell patients how to achieve what they want/need, and/or make the necessary arrangements to acquire what it is the patient wants/needs (as expressed by the patient themself, of course).

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@Jynx wrote:

The goal of therapy is (by-and-large) not to fix the client's issues but to help the client develop skills, find tools, and build up their resources so that they can then solve their own problems - i.e. when therapy ends, and new problems arise, the client doesn't need to go back to therapy to tackle these new problems.

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No offense, but isn't that a really hypocritical principal for the industry to be built upon? When you considder the media pressure they've been exerting in recent years to drum it in to people to: "own up and admit it when they need help with their problems", only to come back and envision your ideal of humanity as a person who can solve all their own problems without any help.

Are you aware of how much material has been put of there, particularly targeting men, proclaiming that it's a male cultural fault, "toxic masculinity", perpetuating a foolhardy belief that men should be able to face their problems all by themselves; while the industry making these proclaimations, endeavors to churn out patients to be people who can face all their problems all by themselves?

The fact is that a lot of the major crisises people face are beyond what a single person can resolve all by themself. They need help. And we are promised that there is help by every single mental health and anti-suicide org that is out there. But when we actually reach out for that supposed help, we discover that we've been lied to, and all we've found is an industry that does nothing more then charge an awful lot of money to tell us: "you have to sort all this out yourself."

I mean if the mental health system isn't willing to roll up it's sleeves and actually help people, maybe it should stop promising the world that: "There is help available!"

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@Jynx wrote:

A therapy relationship is also unfortunately not a friendship, and nor should it be. Again, the goal is to empower the client to be able to tackle their problems, resolve negative self-talk, and give them the ability to then leave the therapeutic relationship.

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The problem here is that, unfortunately, a lot of people don't actually have friends or proper families. So where are they supposed to go for the essential resources that friendships & families provide to those who are blessed with them?

@Historylover Well said. And welcome.

Firstly I must respond to your statement that we don't have time to care. Isn't that the issue? Doesn't that simply show how accepting we are that we can excuse everything because 'life is such a rat-race'? It is only a 'rat-race' when we make it that way because that is how we wish to present ourselves - busy, successful, important, in demand - more so than everyone else. Too busy, in fact, to notice how everything in our lives - and the lives of those who depend on us - is disintegrating? How our society has broken down? Too busy to be busily occupied with the things which should be of the utmost importance to us - our family! Too busy creating an image of 'perceived success' by which we think others will be impressed. I do not subscribe to the belief that others care just because they say they care - or just because they go through the motions of caring - or say nice things, with a nice voice. I say we are all accountable for the effect we have on others' lives.

Society is made up of a multitude of families. I look about me and see a society where divorce is rife, illegitimate children attend their parents' second, third etc. marriage/s - after all, marriage is only necessary after one shows that it isn't necessary in the first place, because social mores,values, niceties don't apply to such parents - from whom such children learn their values etc., and on it goes further disintegrating; where children are put into childcare so that their mothers can go to work - and then expect the Government to pay for it - and complain that their children's schooling hasn't taught them to read - because everything is the teacher's fault and parents have no responsibility; where our elders are put into care; where people fill the holes in their lives with alcohol, drugs etc., and so-called professionals don't know how to admit that they don't know what they are doing and are more interested in feeding their egos and their wallets. Yes, it certainly is a rat-race - because INDIFFERENCE made it that way.

As for the term 'mental illness' - you will have noticed that I use the term 'so-called mental illness' - because, if everyone took off their blinkers-of-convenience they would notice that such people are not the ones who are 'mentally ill' - but the victims of the people who abused them, damaging their personalities, their lives, families, relationships, employability, health, their present and their futures. THEY are the ones who are MENTALLY ILL!

Yes, it certainly is a rat-race!