Re: I've been labelled as treatment resistant schizophrenic

Hello @krs @Zoe7 I can hear that you're having a robust conversation around the pros and cons of taking medication, its long term effects and mental health treatments. This is an important conversation to be having but please keep our guideline of Respect in mind. We strive to make the forums a safe, inclusive space where differing opinions are valued and treated respectfully.

Good idea @Zoe7, please go ahead and create a new thread for this conversation so that you can continue the discussion.

@Former-Member Are you able to track this conversation back to where it started and move all posts into a new thread. It is not my place (nor am I able) here to do that and I feel that leaving any of this conversation here would be a deterrent to any new members posting their introduction here.

@Zoe7 what I'm trying to tell you and what science is trying to tell you is that the entire medication is a side effect. If you believe in science look it up I've been told that by psychiatrist and scientist that will admit this so how can you disagree with that? It is not my fault that I have experienced this to begin with I was too young, but it was my fault in a way because I didn't do anything about it until 23 years of treatment but then again the docile affected of the medication made me not care because that's how it makes people feel. It doesn't make people care as much about suicide but you can't just do that for one thing that has to happen across the board of the brain. There is so much unfortunately you don't understand. I was told by medical health Professionals that I do know what I'm talking about. Ones that have been honest now that the lable that prevents an open discussion to be made. Does that answer your question? I can go deeper.

@Former-Member it would be great and I would appreciate it if a moderator could move it o

I don't disagree with your version of reality but it is just one narrow view and as I said previously - you can choose to believe a singular strain of thinking without looking at all the evidence in it's entirity. That does not mean that what you are saying is not valid but so is the evidence, research and views of others equally valid. We can choose to believe in what we believe in and that can be backed up by research if we look at one strain of such in isolation. You are choosing to go down that path because what you are being told by some backs up your beliefs - as those that I and others converse with, research or believe in backs up ours. It is not that I disagree with your insular knowledge from those particular quarters however from alternative persepectives the view is different. And if you believe that one scientist, one psychiatrist, on researcher - who all have the same views - are more valid than another set of professional saying something different then you are not getting a wholistic approach to the area of mental health nor understanding that different people need different approaches - and that is what it comes down to - everyone is different in their views, the research they have done, the knowledge they have and the treatment required - to invalidate anyone else's intellect in this area is again perpeptuating the stigma attached to those with a mental illness and summising they cannot think for themselves nor be their own architect in their treatment - and for some medication is not only a way forward but necessary for survival.

Hi @Zoe7 and @krs we're concerned that this discussion is coming very close to a guideline break around respect. We are unable to track back and move individual comments to a new thread - but most definitely encourage you to begin a new discussion by going here and clicking new discussion. As a gentle reminder, this forum is a space to support ourselves and each other, with respect and without judgement. We really hope you are able to begin this discussion again, in an alternative area, and look after yourselves and each other within the tone of your posts.

There is no doubt that the health system - and mental health - in Australia is not adequate and certainly does not cover the wide spectrum of people that need help - nor does it always help those people that need it. That is not denied - but be very careful to not presume that other people have not also done what you have done or had experiences and conversations such as you have had - and that has been my point the whole way through - we respect that you have your views but also respect that others (who have also had life experience, mental health experience, research experience, medication experience and questioned the status quo) also have an alternative view that is just as valid because of their own knowledge, experience and views on the issue as well. ...and not all studies are 2 months studies nor are they all financed by the big pharmaceutical companies. I agree that some medications have a limited time frame for effectiveness and that some need to be increased as immunity increases - but that is also not the case for all meds. Here I go back to my original point in response to you saying that medications shorten our life span - and say again that without meds I would not now be alive so whilst you have your view on medication I am also very grateful for them as they not only saved my life but allowed me to get back to work and see some kind of future going forward - so for me they have not shortened my life but substantially lengthened it - and how can that not then be a positive.

@Zoe7 Yes you are right not all studies are funded by big pharma Johanna moncrieff are trying to raise more money for proper unbiased long term studies because so far the problem term ones do not look good. Yet we have medications and doctors telling us that work by fixing chemical imbalances is in the brain. And after sometime they become ineffective at treating the problem and this goes out to everyone that takes them long term, it's a terrible and shocking fact! There are many reasons why people feel down and sad and can't sleep, thoughts of suicide etc. But isn't a biological brain chemistry problem, it's life instances

@krs I've just stumbled on your conversation with @Zoe7 and I too am concerned that your view is somewhat narrow and lacks insight. I'm sure that you have spoken to many experts about medication, treatments and practices.

I have found many people with mental illnesses know far more about their medication and illness than the drs or other health professionals know.

Medications don't enter the general market until a whole range of studies and tests are done. Yes, the big pharma industry has a role in possibly pushing out medication that might be unsuitable a little early. But generally most medications can take between 5-10 years before entering the market. It's highly unethical to put them on the market too early. The risks are far too great.

What evidence do you have that you know more than others 'with a diagnostic label'? How many stories or information have you collected? Is you number stastically significant to be able to categorically state that fact. Please be careful not to insult the intelligence of those persons with lived experience who may be extremely well versed in mental health and illness.

That is not to say you don't know what you are talking about is invalid. It is most definitely valid for you. But it doesn't fit everyone, and pushing your views as the only views that matter is dangerous and inflammatory. As well as invalidating the knowledge and experience others have.

As for the DSM 5. It is but a guide, written by a single organisation. Most health professionals I have discussions with prefer the ICD. But mental illnesses are complex and when you are dealing with humans, then the experience of a mental illness is unique and variable. So how do classify that under a simple label.?

@Sans911 So what you are saying is people that take the medication know more about how it works in the brain than dr's that go through medical school and research into long-term use? That sounds pretty far out there

And you are actually wrong about the medication taking that long to come out into the market it actually is now very short. The fda does not protect us unfortunately, don't trust them.

Alan J Francis that had a key hand in writing the DSM admitted that the 5 vertion is a nightmare so how can you disagree with that? He got paid to create disorders and construct them baced on what reactions people "seem" to be experiencing at the time but has nothing to do with the problem. It's the worst health care problem of all time. The drug companies admitted that the new ones get released quite quickly and we will have to see what happens.