:/

I just wanted to add my voice to yours @TheVorticon in the hope it might help you not feel so alone and maybe, just maybe, you can begin to not blame yourself for them not being able to reach you.

You see, I've completed a course at that same place and their inability to deal with my questions basically caused them to refuse me service, but, they made sure today that they covered their duty of care enough for legal reasons.

I am appalled at the way psychology has fallen into this CBT loop and those who don't fit into their tiny weeny parameters are shunted, none to gently, right out of the way.

I learned that mindspot is allied health - the therapist you get might be anything from a social worker to a psychologist or a nurse - if I'd known that I wouldn' have touched 'em with, well, anything. All those incredible people behind that course and it's a bloody flowchart situation.

I'm coming back from this last couple of weeks of dealing with them broken beyond repair, but now I'm hell bent on saving myself. The DBT books will be here next week and I'll go from there.

I hope you are travelling a little better TheVorticon.

Hi @TheVorticon @Former-Member and others here,

I have only read the current page of this thread so forgive me if I'm off track. I just wanted to echo what you said @Former-Member - the obsession with CBT is appalling. It is gradually changing, as evidenced by the growth of ACT and DBT over recent years. These are known as "third wave" behavioural therapies. They started with strict behaviourism, then moved to cognitive behaviour therapy, and now we are in the "third wave" which still includes a lot of good cognitive-behavioural techniques, but adds a whole lot more like mindfulness and acceptance (i.e. the A in ACT).

I noticed @Former-Member mentioned the other day on another thread that as a psychologist, she was pretty much trained just in CBT. Sadly that remains the norm and it is really up to the individual practitioner to go off and learn more.

@Former-Member I notice you also mentioned that mindspot is allied health - the therapist you get might be anything from a social worker to a psychologist or a nurse. I have big issues with the fact that the term "mental health professional" is extremely vague. I fear that people assume "mental health professional" = a psychiatrist or psychologist, but I know of at least one organisation the defines a "mental health professional" as anyone who has an undergraduate degree in a mental health related field. Amusingly, based on that definition, I myself am a "mental health professional."

I'd love to hear the questions they couldn't cope with @Former-Member (only if you want to share of course).

I see you mentioned your DBT books will be coming soon. I guess that means I REALLY need to pull my finger out and get the next installment of the DBT thread up on Monday. It's virtually done - just needs a tiny bit of playing with. Assuming I don't get hit by any more buses between now and Monday, it should appear then.

I wonder if you would like to come and play on the DBT thread sometime @TheVorticon? I'd super like to see you there.

Hey there @Phoenix_Rising I'm pleased to hear you say that other techniques are showing through, because from my experiences over the last 10 years, all those other methods have been locked away and only CBT is being used. Might be area specific perhaps. I just don't get it. I've done ACT and a few others and they help, a bit, but there just has to be more, it needs to go further - but, I know you know that ...

Yeah, I recognised the same wordology in some of her posts as had been used in recent sessions I've attended with psychs, it saddened me greatly.

I've learned I need to adjust my expectations because I am (was) one of those who expected the 'mental health professional' I'd be dealing with at mindspot (they don't deserve a capital M) would be a fully trained registered psychologist. Duh, how dumb was I! (I edited my post in your thread about the course place just fyi)

Heh, yeah, by that definition I too am a mental health professional. It scares the daylights out of the therapists to know that I've done, in some cases, more study in the field of psychology than they have.

Today I gave the clinic manager a lesson on the difference between patient and client and why it is not appropriate for them to call their clients 'patients'. Deaf ears I think, deaf ears. sigh.

I'm sorry, Phoenix_Rising, I could not share those questions - I will try to think of ways to reformulate them to be less specific, but I don't think that would work either. I know you will understand. I'm broken and will have to reshape myself, I'm looking forward to joining hte thread properly. I don't do face to face groups so the not-being-in-a-group-but-being-in-a-group should work nicely for me.

Oh, goodness, don't stress yourself on my behalf, cos I'm going to have a lot to catch up on! The mail is not always on time and the UK stuff has been taking a few days longer than usual recently, so no worries at all.
If I may, I'd like to second Phoenix_Rising's suggestion @TheVorticon. I like your posts.

pleasant restful thoughts to all

Good morning everyone!

I am just toddling past and just wanted to gently place a little note (now don't everyone roll your eyes at once!)

A service that may not have worked for some of you, may still have value for others and we must be mindful of that. While I understand your passions and an important part of mental health is discussing different experiences - it is equally important not to cause anyone to feel they may not want to access a service. What you have said here is fine, I just wanted to wave my hand with this note for awareness.

Hi @Former-Member

Sorry to hear that you didn’t have a good experience with their course. It’s good that you’ve managed to use the bad experience to empower yourself to try something different. Best of luck with the DBT books.

Going into it, I could tell it was going to be very CBT-ish. It’s not bad for a reading-set of CBT lessons. But I do think they misrepresent what sort of support they intend to provide, although I can only speak from my experience as someone getting messages rather than phonecalls.

There are some aspects of CBT that could help me but what I really wanted out of this is the accountability/encouragement of someone legitimately checking up with how the homework is going, which just doesn’t seem to be part of it.

They did eventually respond to my question last week - they had to consult their psychiatrist to help answer it, hence the delay. Unfortunately I'm not convinced that their answer is correct for me. It's one of those things where according to other previous research I’ve done, a certain course of action is helpful for some situations but can make things worse for others. It's not possible to tell which of the situations I'm in based off a single message when it’s something I can’t self-report other than speculation (as I don’t know). So I’m a bit disappointed that the answer, two weeks in the making, didn’t seem to consider that.

But no worries, I stopped replying after their answer and they're back in fine form on copy-paste easy streak script this week.

Hi @Phoenix_Rising.

I have been occasionally reading along with the DBT thread. If I can think of something worth adding I might chime in, thanks.

I’m not a big fan of labelled ‘techniques’ and ‘strategies’ for stuff like this (and even using the words “techniques” and “strategies”… yuck). Although it makes sense for therapeutic models to have names and labels for things (because common terminology makes it easier to develop a common understanding), it just tends to activate my eyeroll mechanism when it’s pushed too hard. I’m not sure why I dislike therapy jargon so much, but therapy analogies and metaphors are even worse (e.g. the “pillars of self esteem” blahhhhghhhhhhffpp nup nope not happening).

So I like how the DBT thread is open to discussing the ideas, what works for people and what doesn’t, and explains the concepts behind the jargon using normal English.

Also hi to anyone else reading.

Thanks for replying @TheVorticon You have put your experience, which is so close to my own, into better words than I have been able to!

The time delays seem illogical to say the least. If I'd had any of that prior knowledge before going into it, I would not have put myself through that experience because it just rekindled so much of what the problems for me, were and are.

The only reason I managed to get return phone calls was because I kept pushing the point, and in the end that was more unsatisfactory than I can say.

I don't think the experience empowered me, it almost ended me, then my bloodymindedness kicked in and I decided I would not go quietly.

Disclaimer: I recognise that there are those who might well find this service helpful.