A Complicated Story

Dear @Janna

Sleep and exhaustion have been big issues with my son too. I know only too well it is extremely stressful to face it every morning. My is now 22. We attended a Sleep Clinic when he was about 14 for 6 months. Their advice was fairly simple, we followed sleep hygeine and kept diaries. I was discouraged from interfering and my son encouraged to take responsibility for his own wake/rest cycles.

Sleep is still a bit of an issue. I had to accept his lack of school and odd hours and we have cobbled together a life; unusual, but with many good moments for both of us.

My main approaches were to try and find things to interest and engage him so we had positive experiences when awake .. which ended up mainly around music. He also exercised etc and was at a gym for 5 years.

He would volunteer for graveyard shifts etc for work. He has been reliable and held part time work for 3 1/2 years. It is not optimal, but ... We had one year when I was driving him to work at 5 am 5 days per week. I thought it worth encouraging work skills etc and he got himself home.

My son still works p/t and studies privately. I have been highly involved and there have been 2 hospitalisations (13 and 21) but I am making more space for myself and being vocal about his growing independence. Its a hard road but not an impossible one. Good luck.

Thanks Appleblossom for your encouraging story.

In many ways my son's depression and hypersomnia perpetuate further depression and hypersomnia. His life is a lonely one and in my opinion he desperately needs some friends and a postive male role model in his life. He does have some available friends from the first school he attended, but they are completely bogged down with school work and extracuricular activities and have little spare time. In the absence of a suitable sibling (a girl being 5 years older doesn't cut it), a father, or other family, he relies completely on me to fulfil all his needs. I do try to make his waking time as positive as possible, but he is often reluctant to my suggestions. What adolescent boy wants to hang out with his mum? At the moment he has his Learner's Permit and loves driving. He could drive every day for hours on end. I try to do this with him wherever possible, but unfortunately time doesn't permit me to do this as much as what he would like.

When my son is awake, he can be very lucid and appears to have a genuine desire to attend school. He speaks positively about trying to wake the following day, packs his school bag and does everything he should. He goes to bed around 10pm. Nothing he says or does suggests that he doesn't want to wake up or go to school. When morning comes he is unable to wake up. The depth of his sleep is really quite extraordinary and borders on unconsciousness. I attempt to wake him every 15 minutes or so throughout the morning. When he is ready to wake up he does so and it's almost as if he has returned to earth. He has no recollection whatsoever of all my attempts to wake him.

At one stage I thought that Mr Sleepy was related to his reluctance to go to school due to his fear that people are going to judge him for his absence(s). That theory went out the window when the same happened for a big get together and day out that was planned with his group of friends. He was so excited and positive about going, but when morning came the same happened.

I'm going to see if I can somehow find someone who could be a positive role model in his life - preferably male. He really needs for his world to open up to life beyond mum and home. He is reluctant to join sports clubs or anything due to his social anxiety disorder.

Tomorrow is the start of another school week and we'll be aiming to get him there again. If this doesn't happen I'll be making contact with his psychologist and psychiatrist to find out what else we can do to engage him in iife. If Mr Sleepy continues on like this it will make it impossible for him to do anything, be it school/work/social activities and the rest and this will in turn deepen his depression.

Thanks for your reply.

Janna

I hear that you are putting in heaps of effort. Yes the line between depression and normal exhaustion/ energy levels can merge but are definitely not the same. Yet SLEEP can be healing and may be the way he needs to get through his disappointments about the family breakup and life's expectations upon him. One of the advantages he has is a mother who loves him and can show him more than how to get a licence to drive.

Driving is often seen as the big thing for that age, and enough of a rite of passage into maturity. I am very "Skills for LIfe" based. Driving is only one of MANY skills needed. Try and add a couple more interests you can both share .. eg I watched and learned about tennis and son's movies and games. I endured more action and violence on screen than was comfortable for me for about 8 years but it has paid off in that .. we had intelligent discussions about what he was watching .. not totally nagging or politically correct ones .. but i tried to stretch my imagination into his generation to understand how they could be bothered with the stuff that they watch .. we will always be a generation apart but my son came to appreciate my point of view and I his. He developed sensitivity and discernment and grew out of adolescent viewing habits .. but ADOLESCENCE is a huge growth process .. much more than getting drunk or getting a licence or even passing HSC or VCE or whatever exams are the latest.

I tried to get a mentor for my son too .. and sometimes they bond positively or sometimes they show aspects of manhood for him to individuate against.. I keep a conversation about various types of manhood.going .. so that my son has a sense of developing his own unique style.

Good luck this week with the experts and I hope it works out with them, but you can give him more .. Believe he can outgrow his depression and be patient and respectful of your own limits as a way of teaching him to respect himself as well reality testing what it is possible for a human to do.

My son was resistant to the whole teen driving culture .. it turned him off .. we are only doing a little bit of driving now .. so our boys are a bit the same and a bit different.

Maybe parental concerns with children reaching milestones are a sign of our own insecurities .. go with what he wants .. til you honestly cant agree .. that should be enough .. admit it is just you and let him find the gap between expecting mum to be a slave and a fully human person with needs of her own.

HI there, reading your story is amazing and so full of wonderful positives. You have left a bad relation ship. This is a really hard thing for any one to do. Manipulation is a powerful horrid thing. Good for you- you must be a very loving supportive powerful mother 🙂

Give your son some time- 7 weeks of good work doesn't mean all will be well mentally right away. But all the good work you are both doing will pay off later.

When things feel over whelming perhaps try and remind your self of all the good that is now going on- all the goals you are working towards.

I wonder if your son could have a mentor for a positive support- i know Berry Street has a mentoring program for youth. Actually - Berry Street would have a HUGE amount of support and advise to give- the same as Headspace. Both services for high risk youth or youth with mental health issues.

Berry Street:03) 9429 9266 www.berrystreet.org.au

Headspace:(03) 9027 0100 headspace.org.au

I hope this helps

Thanks for sharing your story

Hi,

I just thought I'd post a quick update. Things with my son continue to slide backwards and hit a real crisis point Monday week ago. He dived into a very suicidal, "I'm over everything" mindset and was threatening to end it all that day because he'd had enough. He shut me out completely and in the process left me panicking and overwhelmed. I'm not too familiar with how depression can manifest with family, but being disrespectful, defiant, ungrateful, angry, manipulative and aggressive (he physically punched me) is very hard to tolerate and wears me down.

On the suggestion of Baboo, I thought a mentor would be ideal for him. Unfortunately Berry St is not available in Sydney, but I found an organisation called "Aftercare" which offers the same. I contacted our local branch who verified that this is precisely what they do, and then told me that they are completely indundated at present and would not be able to assist me/son until at least November/December of this year, and even that is a big question mark. So after finding something I thought would be perfect, it all fizzled out to nothing leaving me here not knowing what else I can do.

A question: Is it normal for a severly depressed individual to actively resist help and defiantly refuse to do anything that has been suggested?

My son has had therapy upon therapy upon therapy and has received an enormous amount of information that could assist him and lift his depression a little. He refuses to do anything that has been suggested because "he doesn't feel like it". Likewise, he refuses any suggestion I make.

By the end of last week I was feeling emotionally drained and so over things myself that I found myself almost echoing his sentiments. Not good.

Things have stabilized since and we are now in a lull. He has not attended school for almost two weeks and I have the school counsellor and welfare officer communicating with me on a regular basis. They are now raising a Disability Confirmation Sheet for him with a view to getting him enrolled in a special needs school that is better equiped in dealing with adolescents with psychological/emotional issues. Even that's not going to help or make a difference if he doesn't attend.

Feeling so stuck and just don't know what more I can do.

Janna x

You are probably doing all you can do in your circumstances so dont forget to look a little after you.

Sorry the mentor thing didnt pan out .. but make sure you are on the list. Better late than never.

I hate to say but I had to deal with violence from my brother and sister .. only once from each but it was horrible and broke my heart but didnt stop me from loving them.

Unfortunately my mother lived with a lot of violence form my brother but .. pride and privacy stopped her from getting professional help .. which maybe could have made an enormous difference .. anyway it did not happen for us.

When my son was in year 8 the psych wanted him to go to a special needs school too, but my son and his father flat out refused (ego pride) ... so I sent him to an private alternative school across town .. it had a little good effect but fairly minimal really. I couldnt seem to get much other support .. a girl youth worker came once but couldnt develop a rapport with my son so we were stuck at home for a long time ...

I cannot offer easy answers but my son seems similar to yours in many ways. What has helped was my relationship even if he did not make it easy.

DONT tolerate violence against your person .. let him know that it will only hurt him more than anybody else.

I was LUCKY in that my son knew of (witnessed at early age) the consequences of my brother's violence and made an internal decision not to be violent to me ... he was pretty close though. I was worried when he vented on a few extraneous objects ... like plants or a phot of himself etc ... I tried always to ... validate the emotion ... I understand the reason for your anger etc .... but

I tried to reach my son through a wide range of activities including physical, sporty and creative .. something to allow him to integrate his anger without burning up or lashing out.

Sorry to hear it is still very hard for you and your boy.

Hi @Janna

Thanks so much for providing an update. Wow it sounds like a lot has been going on.

To answer your question... it is not uncommon for people living with severe depression to fiercely deny help for a period of time... sometimes a long time. Sometimes people may have a lack of insight into their mental illness – this is quite common. They may also experience a general lack of motivation to engage in even simple self-help tasks (this is another common symptom of depression). Depression can be very exhausting, and battling thoughts of suicide can leave people feeling incredibly tired. Believe it or not, feeling so low all the time actually takes up a lot of mental energy. Other common feelings associated with depression include a sense of apathy, hopelessness, helplessness, anhedonia and/or irritability. All of these factors can compound on top of one another, and can interfere a person’s willingness to engage in support. Even though your son is not currently attending school, it is still a great thing you have done to set up that support, if and when he is ready to return. While he may not have the capacity to express his gratitude right now, I must say you sound like such an amazing ‘mama-warrior’, fighting fiercely for your son. I get the sense that you are feeling really defeated right now, but I can still sense a strength within you, as I read your post.

I am sorry to hear about Aftercare not working out, at least for the time being. I know one of the reasons why these sorts of organisations take such a long time to match kids with mentors is because of the rigorous background check they do on the mentors. So that is a good thing, as we want to ensure the safety of our children... but of course, I am sure it is frustrating to be turned away or put on a waiting list when you are feeling at your wits end.

If you liked the idea of finding your son a mentor, another organisation that you might like to consider is "Big Brothers, Big Sisters" (Phone: 02 9285 6250). Not sure if you have heard of them before? Their organisation works to facilitate meaningful, monitored mentoring matches between adult volunteers (Bigs) and children (Littles), aged 7-17 years. I am not sure whether they have much of a waiting period, but it couldn’t hurt to ask?

Hope this helps. And please keep us updated on how things are going… It is so lovely to have you be a part of our community 🙂

Thank you both Apple and Mosaic. It's really important for me right now to get validation and support. Thanks for clarifying that what my son is experiencing and expressing is all part of depression. That in itself makes me feel comforted. It's terribly said, and extremely frustrating, to not be able to help or to feel that my efforts are making no difference. Heartbreaking to be honest.

I find that it's very difficult to enforce boudaries with my son because I tend to stretch them to accomodate his depression. That then makes it very difficult for me. If he were a regular teen exerting the normal defiance and pushing boundaries as part of normal development, then I would most certainly feel more comfortable with enforcing appropriate consequences. But I can't do that to him when he's feeling so miserable and battling his own internal demons. That makes parenting him extremely challenging and I never know if I'm doing the right thing or not. In the same token I believe that his depression is not a licence to be disrespectful and abusive.

If anyone has any ideas on how to enforce boundaries in such a situation I'd welcome them. I think this is what is making this very hard for me.

Many thanks for your support

Janna x

Can you find ways to express your understanding of his past expressions of anger without condoning them but seeing them

It seems to be about picking your battles.

Strenghtening connections while setting boundaries.

Does he ever open up about his sense of right and wrong and values etc... talking about politics actually helped my son and I

we found we could agree to hate the same bad guys ... then after a while I could lessen the sense of negativity about it and take the sting out of it .. and now we can laugh and joke about it more lightly.

Somehow I think the answer lies in using the energy of his anger in a wise way for him to come to some self acceptance about his own past behaviour. Sorry I cant think of anything better.

I relaxed my boundaries too much with my son, although I probably had inadequate boundaries to start with. I almost became a teenage boy to be his playmate if he wasnt going out to get friends himself. I dont regret relaxing them as I know that my son knows that he is worthy of love and that I do love him. If I had niggled about minor issues things would have escalated and I did everything I could to connect with him but minimise conflict. My current project is re-etsablishing some boundaries, now that he has got a bit of a life.

Apple,

I have engaged in lengthy discussions with my son and tried to explain how some of his behaviour is disrespectful and hurtful. I hope he takes some of what I say on board but it's very hard to tell because he is a very poor commuicator and generally does not talk unless asked a specific question. He is VERY difficult to connect with and appears highly irritated by my very presence at times, let alone when I open discussion up with him. In my last chat I did explain that there were certain behaviours which I don't like, but reassured him that I still love him as a whole person. I used our cat as analogy and said I don't like it when the cat scratches me because it's nasty and hurts, but that doesn't mean that I don't love the cat, I just don't like it when he does that. I hope that made some sense to him.

I have tried to engage in activities with him, but he shuns every single thing I suggest and basically does not want to spend 1 minute more with me than what he has to. He prefers being solitary. He won't even sit at the table and eat a meal with me, his sister or grandmother and I find myself providing him with room serviced. I've explained that it would be really nice to have his company for a meal - even not every day but at least a couple of times a week but he simply shrugs this away. I try to entice him to get up and go out by suggesting anything and everything I know he likes e.g. how about we go and get some McDonalds. That doesn't work either. He has BIG issues and communication is one of them - that doesn't serve him well anywhere. would describe his disposition as generally quite hostile, defiant and withdrawn.

I'm all out of strategies for now and just hope that time will see an improvemet. I'm also thinking that it may be time for a medication review and possibly another inpatient stay.

Thanks ever so much for your reply.

Jann x