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How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

chibamSenior Contributor06 June 2023, 7:47 pm AEST

How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

I've heard numerous times that I need to make an effort to endure the undesirable elements of life; that I need to make more of an effort to enjoy myself; that I need to harden myself up to the ugliness of life... things of that nature. Basically, that I need to "be better" at suffering through life's crap.

The thing is, I've made a great deal of effort over the years, and I've often really impressed myself with how strong I've become. I'm not completely immune to misery, but I'm at the point now where I am often able to enjoy other peoples' attempts to inflict misery. It's not an airtight shield. Some of the crap still manages to get through and make me feel bad. But I am really impressed by how much I am able to fend off, considdering I am just one man against the whole world, pretty much.

And it really seems like I've gotten to the limit of how much I can accomplish by myself.

But then about a year ago, I blurted out to a family member that I want to die. They definitely heard me, because they responded to the message. And then, within hours, it was as if I'd never said it. And ever since, every indication has been that they aren't aware that they don't actually know I want to die. e.g. They keep making insinuations that I'm still gonna be alive well into the future, ect.

And thinking about this, it really makes me feel like such a weakling; that they are able to just completely erase that message that they found distasteful from their minds and carry on as if it never happened.

It makes my wins seem so petty by comparison.

Is that the standard they are measuring me against? The ability to just completely blank out the parts of life we don't like and be totally unaware of their existance? I would love to be able to do that. But considdering how hard I've had to work to get just as far as I am, I just don't see how it'll ever be possible for me. I feel like a guy who's just practically kiIIed himself trying to get to the top of Mt. Kosciusko, and watching a bunch of other people dancing around on the summit of Mt. Everest.

I'd love to know their secret. But the thing is, I just don't know whether this is something I can actually fix, or whether I'm just too weak to meet that standard.

n.b. Please, no anti-suicide emails mods, just because I've mentioned wanting to die. To use your language, I am "safe."

7 replies

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In response to: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

ClockFaceSenior Contributor06 June 2023, 8:46 pm AEST

Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

@chibam

I too find the judgement of other people really difficult to deal with. Them determining how much pain Im in psychologically and physically, how much they are willing to believe I am in. Then based on that how much I can perserver or push through to achieve different things. Pain is a big one for me at the moment, the determination of my family is that it is not as significant as I am saying it is and therefore I am capable of doing more housework. With pain and mental health issues, both severe at the moment and under multiple doctor/specialist care I am off work on income protection. But according to my family I should have returned to work by now, despite the directions of those professionals, and they "encourage" on a regular basis for me to push for that. Not because they want me to but because I do, I am pushing for that but my rehab team have stated it will be some weeks yet. They are "encouraging" me because they believe me to be in less pain and affected less by my mental health than I am. I want to because I like my job and I want some purpose in life again.

People like that will never change their minds or admit they are wrong, despite plenty of evidence I cant get my family to budge. Despite the type of pain killers Im on and their strength, lets say not your regular pain medication, one is a patch. Despite the fact Im a fortnight or so from my 7th spinal procedure in the past 12 months. I cant get them to even consider that Im in extraordinary pain and Im literally doing all I can to help.

I think that what you have to do is not try and prevent the horrible things in life from affecting you but the words and actions of horrible people in life that want to dismiss and deminish the horrible things in life that affect you. You, I assume have mental health issues and different things affect us differently than that of people without mental health issues. We react differently, we feel some stuff more intensly and some stuff that maybe we should, less so. We are not always rational. But we arent weak, you're not weak.

In response to: Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

chibamSenior Contributor06 June 2023, 9:18 pm AEST

Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

Sorry to hear about your struggles, @ClockFace . It sounds as if your pushing yourself to your limit. I'm glad that, at least, you seem to have doctors who can appreciate your actual plight and can advise you accordingly. It sounds like they at least can provide you with some reliable insight as to where it's fair for you to draw your own limits.

I'm just confused as to what's possible - and fair, and what is not. "Weak" is often treated like a four-letter word, and so perhaps I should not have used it. But however you choose to phrase it, some people just don't have the chops to go as far as others have gotten. Some people don't end up becoming pro footballers because they simply don't put the dedication in to go that far. But then some people train even harder and longer then most of the pros, and yet they still don't make the grade. Their bodies just aren't up to that standard.

I feel like I'm the latter type, when it comes to immunizing myself against misery. I've tried my hardest; I've tried everything I can think of, and I've only come so far; while others who seem much less dedicated are able to do so much better then me. But I guess I'll never know for sure.

In response to: Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

NatureLoverSenior Contributor07 June 2023, 6:28 am AEST

Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

@chibam , I'm so sorry about that family member who pretty much ignored what you told them. THEY are inadequate, not you.

Sadly, I do think that some of us aren't capable of reaching the heights that others are.

In response to: Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

chibamSenior Contributor07 June 2023, 2:52 pm AEST

Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

Thanks, @NatureLover . 🙂🤗

I think it's a bit unkind to call this other person inadequate; I'd say their merely cut from a differant cloth.

I really don't know what to make of them, in terms of trying to gauge what is achievable. It's not as if they are totally oblivious to the things they hate about life. They spend most of their time complaining about everything/everyone they hate. But the way they've just completely blanked out this statement I made, as if it never happened... I'd love to be able to do that. How much more livable might life be, if we could just instantaneously blank out the things we don't like, like how those modern mobile phones can erase the unwanted background clutter from images.

I've had so many tiresome experiances in my life; ordeals where I was counting the seconds until it would all be over and I could just call it a day. Ordeals that left me hoping and praying that that would be the last time I ever had to go through anything like that. Everybody else just expects/demands that I'll get right back on the horse, and go back for another round of the same, the next time I am summoned to do so.

How much easier would those chores have been if I'd been able to just tune them out? Blank them out of my mind as if they weren't even happening? It's an enviable superpower, for sure. One that I've gotten okay at, but never truly mastered.

@NatureLover wrote:
Sadly, I do think that some of us aren't capable of reaching the heights that others are.

Indeed. But telling the ones who are from the ones who aren't is no easy feat, it seems.

In response to: Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

NatureLoverSenior Contributor08 June 2023, 7:33 am AEST

Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

Gosh, @chibam , I was glad to read your reply to me this morning - thank you! I had an awful feeling last night in bed that I might have offended you - I thought maybe I wasn't clear enough and you might have thought I was saying *you* can't reach the heights others can. I was thinking of myself when I wrote that! I would never say that about someone else specifically, especially as I don't know you well.

@chibam wrote:
I think it's a bit unkind to call this other person inadequate; I'd say their merely cut from a differant cloth.

I don't like being unkind, so thank you for pointing that out to me, I appreciate it.

@chibam wrote:
I've had so many tiresome experiances in my life; ordeals where I was counting the seconds until it would all be over and I could just call it a day. Ordeals that left me hoping and praying that that would be the last time I ever had to go through anything like that. Everybody else just expects/demands that I'll get right back on the horse, and go back for another round of the same, the next time I am summoned to do so.

I agree, no-one would want to do that.

@chibam wrote:
How much easier would those chores have been if I'd been able to just tune them out? Blank them out of my mind as if they weren't even happening? It's an enviable superpower, for sure. One that I've gotten okay at, but never truly mastered.

Are you talking about dissociation? Sadly this is all too easy for me; I learnt it as a child in an abusive family. On the other hand, I've often thought that if I hadn't been able to do this, I might have turned to illegal drugs maybe, or alcohol to blot out the pain. I'm glad that at least you have some success in blanking out those things you hate.

In response to: Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

chibamSenior Contributor08 June 2023, 3:50 pm AEST

Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

@NatureLover wrote:
Gosh, @chibam , I was glad to read your reply to me this morning - thank you! I had an awful feeling last night in bed that I might have offended you...

No worries, @NatureLover 🙂. I tend to keep irregular hours, so please don't worry if I fail to reply to things immediately.

@NatureLover wrote:
Are you talking about dissociation?

Hmm. I don't think so. But then. I don't know much about that, aside from what I've seen in Hollywood movies.

I guess what I'm talking about is more along the lines of "automatic ignorance." Or, perhaps even better, "automatic reinterpretation"; reinterpreting bad situations into enjoyable ones.

I don't know. Sometimes I think we put far too much pressure on ourselves to make ourselves happy, when in truth, part of that duty ought to fall on those around us. We shouldn't have to devote all our time and effort into trying to undo the misery that everybody else inflicts upon us. The onus shouldn't be entirely upon us to dig ourselves so deeply into self-deception that we are able to satisfactorily pretend that we want them around.

The lines between right and wrong aren't so easy to spot here.

In response to: Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

NatureLoverSenior Contributor09 June 2023, 7:15 am AEST

Re: How Do You Tell Whether The Problem's That You Aren't Trying Hard Enough, Or If It's That Your Just Not Strong Enough/Good Enough?

Hi @chibam 🙂

I guess what I'm talking about is more along the lines of "automatic ignorance." Or, perhaps even better, "automatic reinterpretation"; reinterpreting bad situations into enjoyable ones.

This seems difficult to me...I think it might be what's known as "reframing"?

Wishing you good things...

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