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Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Things have changed a lot since I first started taking notice of the public dialog about mental illness/mental health. In those days, all anyone ever talked about was "mental illness" - specifically referring to something that was causing the brain to not work right.

But since then, there had been much more recognition that the causes of many supposed cases of "mental illness" are actually real world problems, and not some sort of malfunction in the brain. We've even gone so far that many official documents are openly proclaiming that "mental health" and suicide should be handled as completely separate issues now, as quite often, the people who attempt/commit suicide are completely sane.

Few people would deny that the original concept of "mental illness" - that some people are depressed, anxious, suicidal, paranoid, ect. because something has gone wrong in their brains - is at least somewhat true. Many people do suffer in these ways in part or in whole because of some internal problem. But we are starting to recognize that, in many cases, the sufferers brain is not malfunctioning and that it does not need any sort of treatment, because the real problem is elsewhere.

However, this new awareness is often becoming muddied and confusing to a lot of people. I had a conversation just the other day that made me realize we still have a long way to go before we're all on the same page.

I read this SANE factsheet earlier, to try to get some sense of where we are in terms of the official literature these days. And it concerns me a bit that there's only a fleeting mention of real-world problems, that doesn't lead to a more substantial discussion.

When these feelings persist − but don't seem to have a cause that justifies them − and interfere with the ability to lead and enjoy everyday life...

Then it gets even more confusing a little further down, in the section addressing the importance of Support in the Community; as it leans upon one of the most ambiguous and therefore meaningless phrases of our time: "psychosocial disability". There's not even anything close to a consensus about what this terms means. I've seen numerous prominent people explain it in such a way that implies it requires both an actual mental illness (e.g. Schizophrenia) and a significant real-life problems (e.g. chronic unemployment). However, I've also seen prominent people imply that it can exclusively refer to a real-life problem; so if you are being bullied, that alone means you have a "psychosocial disability".

And this ambiguity is really relevant, because it contributes so badly to the mass confusion about whether a person's depression, suicidalness, anxiety, ect. may exclusively be caused by some real-world suffering they are undergoing.

Novices stumbling across that fact sheet looking for information will probably have no way of definitively understanding that jargon. But because of the connotations of that word, "disability", it may prime them to assume that there is some sort of internal fault within the person who is suffering, when that may not be the case at all. That, in turn, might lead them to try to steer the sufferer towards solutions that are geared towards correcting the person (e.g. medication, "talk therapies", ect.), when in fact the only remedy they really ought to be considdering is to eliminate the sufferer's real-life problem.

We are acknowledging that real-life problems are, quite often, the entire essence of a person's distress. But, from my recent observations, we don't seem to be acknowledging it enough, nor with enough clarity and detail. Because there are still a lot of people who seem to be convinced that depression, anxiety, suicidalness, ect. must - to at least some degree - indicate some sort of internal breakdown within the sufferer that needs to be "treated".

Which leads me to another bit of information on this SANE factsheet which, IMHO, is probably quite (unintentionally) misleading. Namely, the subject heading: "You can’t just ‘snap out of’ a mental health issue".

This is certainly true, as is the contents of that entire section of the page. But I'm starting to get the impression that people are misunderstanding the meaning of that phrase. Specifically, I think people are misinterpreting it to mean that there are no straightforward fixes to mental health problems.

No, you can't just "snap out of" being suicidally depressed about being lonely. But you can be rapidly and effectively cured of it by entering into a meaningful new relationship with someone. You can't just "snap out of" your chronic anxiety that your spouse is going to beat you up again. But you can have that anxiety largely (or perhaps entirely) alleviated by being taken out of that violent household; and having safeguards applied to insure you never encounter your abuser again.

Often our grief does have relatively straightforward solutions. But unfortunately, many people have been lead to believe that it doesn't. So instead of taking any interest in actually fixing our problems, they push "mental health" treatments upon us that do nothing to try to fix the real problems. Hence we get nowhere, fast; and our problems persist and typically get worse and worse.

Which brings me to a few of the other common catchphrases that really drives me nuts:

"You shouldn't try to help them.."

"You can't help them..."

"Don't try to 'fix the problem', you should just sit there and listen..."

And I apologize to the forum regulars, because I know I've ranted and raved about this one several times before; but it apparently bears repeating.

Once again, I'm not denying that there's sound reasoning behind these statements, nor am I denying that, in many circumstances, they are really good advice.

But we need to make it clear to the public that there are also a lot of circumstances where this is disastrously bad advice! And that anyone who is getting involved with another person's grief really needs to determine what sort of problem the person is suffering, and whether or not real-life help is called for. Because it often is! Sometimes, you really should do your best to try to fix the suffering person's problem!

Once again, I'm not denying or belittling the experiances of people who really do have mental illnesses; nor the appropriateness of the treatments they engage in. Mental illness is a real thing, and therefore, treatments that are geared towards correcting the brains of the sufferers are valid, in such circumstances.

But we need to acknowledge that serious, long-term bouts of mental suffering via depression, anxiety, sucidalness, or any of a dozen other enduring negative emotions, are often solely caused by some sort of real-life crisis, with no malfunction going on in the brain whatsoever. And that often such cases of distress can be easily and effectively cured, if only someone takes the time to eliminate the real-world problem that's causing it.

Set your lonely single neighbor up with a boyfriend who she is highly compatable with.

Go down to your kid's school and get the staff to shut down the bullies who keep labelling him "fat piggy" all over social media. Make the bullying stop.

Arrange a decent job for your chronically unemployed sister-in-law, that helps her achieve her career goals.

Offer a loan to your financially-struggling coworker; or, if you can't manage that, seek out some way they can get the money they need to tie themselves over.

Help your teammate who's stuck in an unhappy household intergrate into a new, better-fitting household.

Or, if you can't be bothered sticking your neck out for your suffering acquaintance, then don't.

Just don't go making out that their grief is primarily in their head, and that it's their brain that needs to be corrected; or that they just need a professional to browbeat them into "coping" with their distressing lives. Because often the problem is nowhere near their brains. Their brains are perfectly fine.

Fix the life problem and you fix the grief. I can't say it any plainer then that.

That's not an answer for every case of distress; but we need to make it well known that it is the best answer for a great many cases of distress.

Because, from what I've seen recently, there are still far too many people who just cannot look past the brain.

28 replies

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In response to: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

@petrichor I have to totally agree. I have made changes in my life over the past 30 years but to this day, I am still taking anti depressants. I am convinced there is a chemical imbalance in my brain. I wonder how many of these experts have ever suffered with depression and/or anxiety.

I am sure there are a lot of people who have a great life but still struggle with mental problems.

In response to: Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Hi @Kitty1231

i don’t think lifestyle changes can always solve the problem. I’m sorry you’ve been suffering so long. I’m getting told that it’s ok to take meds all your life. I hate going to the pharmacy to pick all my meds up, I just hate taking meds.


i think there is a difference between chronic mental illness and a bout of depression or anxiety, that doesn’t mean that it isn’t as frightening or less intense or requires less treatment than chronic illness, it ‘just’ isn’t life long. I don’t think many went through covid without having anxiety and lockdowns would have gotten people depressed. I so much hope that they will improve and heal over time. I’m worried about the kiddies & youngsters though.

i wasn’t diagnosed with ptsd until a few years ago and I had ptsd from when I was a child. I also see that I had bipolar and other things probably from my teens. It’s not something that just goes away. When people grow up and live 40 years with ptsd, they cannot just get over it - I don’t even know who I was or would have been without the trauma. The whole discussion is depressing. Until covid we didn’t get the option of Telehealth or 20 sessions, I’m just glad they’re keeping it now.
take care Kitty

In response to: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Sorry, @Historylover , @MDT . I'd tossed up whether or not to split it into two separate posts just before I posted it. In retrospect, I wish I had. 🤔


@Historylover wrote:

I am going to concentrate on this issue: (Biomedical Mental Illness). I am questioning whether we are talking here about 'paranoia' or 'schizophrenia'. (And that is a major stumbling block - speaking the same language with the same interpretation and word usage). In my opinion, it would be unusual for either to suddenly occur without a buildup of events and experiences which left the individual to draw that conclusion or response.


Well, it wasn't my intention to give a perfect depiction of schizophrenia. I was merely trying to use brief examples to illustrate the distinction between "mental problems" and "real life problems".

I admit that I have no personal experiance nor expertise with schizophrenia, so I suppose it was inevitable that I was going to get some details wrong. I think it's "paranoia" if you just "have a feeling" (incorrectly) that there's a terrorists cell embedded around you plotting to kiII you; it's schizophrenia if you literally see non-existant terrorists charging at you with rifles. But once again, I might have that wrong. It's not my area.

Either way, we are talking about a problem that exists primarily within the victim's head - even if the problem was triggered or enhanced by some real-world element.


@Historylover wrote:

I don't believe anyone lives a peaceful, uneventful life. I can't see the possibility of that for any of us. Life just isn't like that. Even when it may seem so, events are taking place over which we have no control and the true state of things only manifests itself when a seemingly unexpected event occurs.


Lol. You should meet my family. Our lives have been so dull, it's a mystery how any of them have managed to stay awake through it all.

In response to: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion


@MDT wrote:
You mentioned an example about being gay in a religious family and them not assisting you to move somewhere to find a partner.

I don't mean to intrude but is this experience?

I would love to know more about your experience as to why this is an issue.

It's a metaphore for experiance. 😉

I'm straight. But my birth environment isn't my true community; and the "family" I've been born into hold people like me in contempt.

Over the years, I've read/seen much about the experiances of gay people who have grown up trapped in vigorously anti-gay families/communities. Despite the differances in our sexual orientations, the similarities between those people's plights and my own are truly striking.

You see parents using any and all excuses in the book to try to refute the reality that their son/daughter is immutably homosexual:


"Oh, they've just been lead astray..."
"They've just made some bad decisions with their life..."
"The school system let them down..."
"Their just confused..."

Any convoluted explaination they can cling to, aside from the plain simple truth that has been explicitly explained to them a thousand times over: their son/daughter is gay.

That's my family to a tea. They don't want to acknowledge who I truly am. No matter how many times they've been told.

There was this scene in Modern Family once where Mitchel (the gay son) relates his experiance of coming out to his father:


"When I was young... I don't know if dad thought I was always saying: "I am grey"...

It was funny. But I just found that so relatable. Because you can be talking in plain english, and they don't hear it because they don't want to hear it. I had that. There's this look of shell shock on their faces. You leave it alone because you figure they just need time for it to sink in. But then later on, they keep carrying on as if you never said anything to them. So determined is their denial that, as far as their concerned, the truth was never spoken at all.

And there's the liberty they feel in disparaging your people while your sitting right there in the middle of the room. But it's differant from criticism they would openly deal right to your face if they wanted to blatantly rip in to you. It's not even a snide, veiled jibe at you. It's much more dismissive then that. It's like they are talking about a group who aren't in the room, even though you are. Their denial is so strong, that they can't even face up to the fact that they are taking a swipe at you by disparaging your people. They just can't face up to the fact that you are one of these people they hate.

I would say that the only significant differance I've noticed between the plight of gays trapped in homophobic families and my own is that there is a mainstream awareness and normality of gays, and even the plights they suffer when they grow up in the wrong environments. Gay people aren't guaranteed a community within their own household (but then, who is?), but if their household refuses to acknowledge who they are, there are plenty of others in mainstream society who will accept them for who they are and offer support.

I don't believe that the mainstream would be so quick to understand someone like me, or to show me compassion. Frankly, if they were, I think I would've been able to stumble upon support from an outside source somewhere by now.


@MDT wrote:
I would love to know more about your experience as to why this is an issue.

In the interests of being open - I will go first.

Thank you for your openness. 🙂 I wish I was able to reciprocate that to the same degree, but... too many bad reactions in the past. I'm afraid I just don't feel comfortable blurting out what I stand for.

Basically, the essence of who I am is that I am dedicated to creating as much joy as I possibly can. I view situations that are devoid of joy as regrettably missed opportunities, and I utterly loathe misery. Frankly, I believe that we as a species ought to be seeking to eradicate that malady, just as we've eradicated smallpox. Or, failing that, to limit it's occurances as much as we possibly can.

For reasons I don't understand, that's very contentious. Some people belittle that ambition because they believe it to be impossible. But what has really astounded and horrified me over the past few years is the fact that a lot of people don't want it to be accomplished. They want the world to be miserable!

But the essence of my rift with my family comes down to the value of education. My family are almost entirely academic people, and either view education as an asset, or at the very least a bearable burden. I personally believe it to be a grievous handicap that ruins a person's ability to create joy in the world.

My family just doesn't want to face up to the fact that education is contrary to who I am and everything I stand for. So, they make up their own mythologies for why I'm much less educated then they want me to be.

And then there are plenty of other points of contention the come in to play, such as the importance of money, and the relative importance of love; the rationality of surviving vs. the rationality of suicide... other things, too.

Frankly, I don't have the oomph right now to go through the entirety of all the ways my family and I can't relate to one another. As I write this, I'm realizing more and more that I probably need a novel-length explaination to clarify everything and why I believe what I believe. And in any event, it can't be a fair assessment on my family's part, as I don't really understand them at all.


@MDT wrote:
Your point about helpers wanting to exploit is very true. I had that experience from religion. Certain figureheads in the church environment would talk about "certain things" at that age and seek to control the environment through manipulation. The notion that one could be suffering mentally was severely frowned upon. Apparently it meant that I wasn't relying on God.

Damn, that's familiar. A very long time ago, I made the mistake of reaching out for help from a supposed "friend", who just happened to be a devout christian. Apparently, all my grief was due to me "rejecting the reality of god". 😒

I'll never make that mistake again - reaching out to an overtly religious person. Then again, maybe that's just one facet of a bigger mistake: reaching out to someone who's cut from a differant cloth. Judging by how all my other attempts to reach out have gone, I'd say that that's the real folly.


@MDT wrote:
Perhaps the most important thing can be summed up in the maxim - know thy self

Knowing myself has never been the problem. It's trying to figure out everybody else that's always given me the headaches.

In response to: Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

@petrichor I am sad to hear your suffering form PTSD and being bi polar. My brother is also suffering and has only just been diagnosed and he is 70. It doesnt really bother me being on medication, I am 67, so too late to worry to much about that part. And I have been on it many years, The only problem is they do stop working after a while then you have to through changing meds again. Its always a roller coaster changing. I am going through this at the moment. At my age I just want to be content and happy. but thats not always possible. I wish you all the best in your journey, and thank you for responding.

In response to: Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

@petrichor @Kitty1231 I just wanted to clarify that I never meant to imply that every case of mental illness/depression/ect. is based upon some real-life problem; nor that real-life solutions will make a positive differance to every person suffering.

I acknowledge that there are countless cases of mental illness, ect. where the only sorts of remedies that may be effective are ones that target the sufferer's mind; be it through drugs,"talk therapies", or other similar things (e.g. meditation, ect.)

I know a lot of people in that boat get pressured in to having others interfere with their lives, under promises that the real-life changes will do something to alleviate their suffering - but then no such relief ever comes. I agree, that's totally unfair. And just as an aside, people who are suffering from real-life problems often face similar difficulties, where outside "helpers" do offer to help fix the person's life - but then the so-called help actually turns out to be some extremely unhelpful gesture.

Anyway, my only intention with this thread was to draw attention to the fact that a lot of people really do need real-life help - and in fact, need nothing else aside from real-life help. It was never my intention to take away from the people who don't fall in to that category, much less to deny their existance. I apologize if I did either of those things.

In response to: Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Hi @chibam

thank you for your message. I didn’t think it was intentional and I’m not well at the moment so its a difficult post.

have a nice day.

In response to: Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

Re: Mental Problems vs. Life Problems - There Is Still So Much Confusion

@chibam I have probably taken your post a little too personal as I am struggling myself with anxiety at the moment.

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