Questions about suicide ideation (May be triggering content)

I’m really sorry you’ve experienced it your whole life @Maggie

Its good that there is still something stopping you, maybe it’s the only time fear of failure is a good thing 🤔.

In a strange way I think I can identify a bit with being so tangled with SI it’s hard to do it as everything, absolutely everything feels overwhelming and too difficult to think through. My brain crashes to the point of not functioning at all sometimes.

Im really happy for you to write more if you want. I’m sure the more thoughts here the more helpful for everyone. Although I started with questions I think it’s turning into a good discussion topic too with lots of thoughts.

I wish you well and thanks for joining in the discussion. I’m feeling very grateful that members are. 💜🤗

Thanks so much for your essay @CheerBear 😄. I’m afraid I don’t think I have an essay in me to return 😳😏.

My surfacing is a bit wonky at the moment. Last night and again this morning I was flooded with si thoughts again but without the intensity so it was/is very manageable.

I think I always come out of it almost in a huge relief (resulting in overcompensating) then stumble a bit pulling myself together.

I have also found it really reassuring having lots of 'me too' moments reading responses in this thread as well as knowing there are differences but it all results in the same thing - SI. 💜🤗

@Teej@CheerBear Reading through responses again brought back some past memories. The point @Former-Member makes about SI needing to be understood as trauma is I think really important. I have been told I was just attention seeking when admitted to emergency and then hospital. I think it's supposed to shock you out of your present ' attention seeking state'. I've also received the same message regarding SH.

I have been shocked at the lack of understanding from mental health workers, though I have also heard some express gratitude at having received good care. Maybe that all depends on the care providers and their understanding or lack of understanding.

Sorry I think I've gone off topic so will leave it here.

I really am finding this thread interesting, so many of us keep these thoughts to ourselves as though it is bad to be having them, rather than a response to severe illness.

@CheerBearyou said " I look at the kids and the guilt can eat me" Oh I so feel like this but also in different ways. When I have SI and they are strong I feel so guilty afterwards. How can I contemplate this, how can I think of putting my kids throuh this pain.

I don't think you have to have kids to think this way. These feelings can come with a partner, pet, friends, anyone really.

@MaggieI am sorry you have had that "attention seeking" label thrown at you, and I think it is an important discussion to have. Last time I meet with my GP, i told her I was having strong SI, she smiled at me and said I shouldn't be having them becasue I was getting help from the pdoc and psych.

I am also finding this thread really interesting to read. It is also making me realise that I am not in this alone.

sorry for the delay in responses @Teej but here are my experiences in this

edit: i should also meantion that my suicidal thoughts come when my depression gets really bad ( usually i dont want to do this stage) or when my anxiety is super high (usually the i cant do this stage)

1) how long do your SI urges go for?

My suicidal thoughts seem to be constant but more often in the background constantly nagging me. It kind of reminds me of a young child that wants your attention and the more you ignore the them more constant 'hey pay attention to me' antics come along, with this they often become a lot loud for me. So in saying that my SI never really leaves me it just get louder and quieter through the motions. When it becomes really strong they are very hard to ignore and it takes a very long time- hrs, days to get them to quiet back down again.

Its the same with SH urges, they are always around but they fade quite abit now that im working on them a lot more rather than just resorting to sh at the drop of a hat. These urges could last hrs and hrs to be able to control.

2) when you’ve come through them what do you find helps the most?

This one im not 100% sure what your asking so if im off track then please do pull me up and ill retry again.

Once ive got through the intense part I find I need to actually just rest, or do something relaxing, most of the time watching a movie or a bath or something similar. Sometimes though I get a little burst of energy and I try to be productive like going for a walk in nature, helping others on the forums, problem solving I also find helpful as well. If I have a whole heap of issues ill try to pick one or two manageable ones and try to work through them more.

3) do you understand your triggers for intense SI?

There are a few triggers that really set me my intense SI off. One of which I only learnt today.

The first one is pain. This pain can either be psychological or physical (chronic pain conditions) but it sends me spiralling downwards really fast. It starts to remind me of my past, and my own thoughts whether they are rational or irrational fears about my future. Basically I want to pain to end.

The second one is the emotional abuse I cop. it makes me feel even more worthless than I already do, being a dissapointment and a burden again whether they are rational or irrational thoughts. With is it is a matter to ending my life to 'save' others. That way I cant do any more 'damage' to anyone else, I dont want to burden people with my troubles. Without me being here they can live their happy lives without having worry what my next issue will be, without them having to feel embarrassed of me as well. Alot of the time for this including when i have been in hospital i have been called an attention seeker, and because ive been told this so many times i start to beleive it which again sends me spiraling down more

The third one- which is the one I learnt today is lacking control. It makes me spiral out of control as well. My mh cycle goes like this and basically explain this third trigger- my mh cycle- negative self talk, lacking self confidence, not feeling in control, feeling overhelmed then acting on suicide thoughts to gain control.

The fourth one is actually the pressues im constantly under. It always makes me feel like im not good enough, im dissapointing people, I dont deserve to be alive and all those associated feelings.

4) what helps you the most to ride them?

When the thoughts are quiet but do a 'pop up' I find acknowledging them and lots of distractions can help. When they are louder and very hard to ignore I try anything and everything from journalling, to distractions, to using helplines and chatting on the forums to help me, as well as a safety plan with reminders on them. Basically anything that keeps me away from my own thoughts. My artwork and music has been a god send for sure! These 2 are my main things that help as well (when I can be motivated to do my artwork)

One thing when they arent too loud I tend to problem solve with the help of others, sometimes actually working through whatever has set me off and finding solutions puts things back into perspective as well.

5) do you feel like it’s very real that you need to die and every time feels like it’s different from the last so it’s hard to think it’s something that will pass?

I have had suicidal thoughts for quite some time however I never really understood them and even thought they were normal to have all the time until someone pointed out they werent (that being a mh professional). I knew ther was something wrong with me but could never work it out until I went to the gp and accepted that I needed help.

The intense SI feels extremely real and the thoughts going through my mind tell me I shouldnt be here. I dont deserve to be here. Sometimes I can ignore them but.... I have 4 attempts to my name 3 being last yr and one this year ( I am not proud of those at all)

6) is it just practice going through it lots that gets you through?

Im not too sure what you mean by this question......

7) if it no longer happens to you what do you think was the turning point

I havent had a turning point as yet as I still constantly fight and float with these thoughts.

Hi @Teej,

Here are my answers to your questions...

1) How long do your SI urges go for?

Most of the time I am entirely indifferent about my life. That is, I'm not actively suicidal, but I am ok with the thought of dying, too. When I am in crisis, the urge to suicide generally lasts for several hours.

2) When you've come through them, what do you find helps the most?

For me, the single most helpful thing is to talk to someone. This is why I struggle so much with having no-one that I can pick up the phone and call.

3) Do you understand your triggers for intense SI?

The biggest trigger for me is any sort of abandonment. This is why my turtle whisperer dumping me was the single most destructive thing she could do. I also struggle a lot around my lack of employment so anything related to that also tends to trigger intense suicidal ideation.

4) What helps you the most to ride them?

Again, talking to someone. And again, this is why having no one who I can call is so super super super hard.

I also find it helpful to daydream about suiciding. I notice a lot in Forum Land that people talk about being scared of the urge to suicide. I really like how this is discussed in DBT. According to Linehan, thinking about suicide, talking about suicide, planning suicide, and daydreaming about suicide is completely ok. No one ever died by thinking about dying! They are just thoughts. Thoughts can't hurt you. The only issue is acting on those thoughts. Thus I find it really helpful to lie in my bed and daydream about suiciding. I also often daydream about how I might die if I don't suicide. I find it very comforting to remind myself that I can be 100% certain that I will die one day. Whatever I am struggling with at any given moment definitely won't last forever because one day I will die.

5) Do you feel like it's very real that you need to die and every time feels like it's different from the last so it's hard to think it's something that will pass?

It used to definitely be like that, but over the past couple of years I have become better at remembering I have survived worse in the past. I experienced my most catastrophic loss in 1996. I am still grieving that loss. I have had oh-so-many losses since then and now I tend to remind myself that I survived the loss of E so I can survive the current loss too. Having said that, loss has a cumulative effect and even though I know I can survive the loss of my turtle whisperer, I truly believe that my soul has died and thus I'm not sure that I will ever do anything more than merely survive now.

I think also, for me now it isn't that I feel I "need" to die, but rather that I may at some point "choose" to die. My suicidal ideation has definitely changed over recent years such that I feel much calmer now and like I will simply one day choose to suicide, rather than it being an impulsive act (which was the case during my twenties).

6) Is it just practice going through it lots that gets you through?

Um...I think practice is certainly a part of it. For me, I think it has changed in recent years because I am so much older now and given that both my parents died young, I think it is highly probable that I am more than half-way through the term of my natural life. I find this comforting and the thought that I will probably die young naturally, helps me to get through the waves of suicidal ideation much better than when I had an entire life stretching before me during my twenties.

Random point

This really is random, but it just popped into my head.

For me, it is very important to differentiate between suicidal behaviour and parasuicidal behaviour. If you were to ask my mum (which would be tricky given that she is dead!), she would say I attempted suicide about 25 times during my twenties. However, really, I engaged in about 24 acts of parasuicidal behaviour and had one actual suicide attempt. I found learning about the concept of parasuicidal behaviour really helpful.