Saintly Mother - so I'm Told

Hey @DoriansDorter ,

Welcome to the forums! I'm hearing you and so sorry you've had to endure this pain all your life.

By connecting with others on the forums, I hope you feel supported and I'm sure you are not alone in experiencing this.

Do you have people you can talk to about it?

What about any professional supports @DoriansDorter ?

None. I did see a counsellor for about 5 visits. That was 2 years ago. She was happy that I've done a great deal of healing all by myself. I could go back to her again to ask advice about this issue.

That might be a good idea to reach out to someone @DoriansDorter .

I hear how difficult it is, especially when you have experienced the 'other side' of things.

At the same time, even it if takes time, it sounds like people eventually work her out. Is that fair to say?

I hope you can find a way to allow yourself to move on and look after yourself. I acknowledge how painful is it so watch her weasel her way through things, but I tend to be a firm believer that what goes around, comes around.

I'll give you an example. There was recently 2 people in my life who obviously can't stand me. They would do anything to make me look bad. I didn't retaliate when they said some horrible things to me. I'm not going to lie, what was said really hurt. But I was determined not to let it get to me and not to let it hold me back. It didn't take long before others checked in with me and realised what these two people had done. I never fought back. I never tried to argue back... I just let it be... and Voila! I've been more supported by people than ever 🙂 I was quite pleased with the result because I was just happy to move on.

In a way, I felt that if I held a grudge or was angry, then they would be laughing and 'winning'. This is how I tend to cope with challenging people...

Sorry if I'm totally off track.

No, probably not fair to say people work her out. My husband took 48 years even with me telling him the truth for a good 40 of those years. He's the original Pollyanna, thinking everyone on the planet means well. There's wonderful and painful for me in that, but he's a good man. Others don't seem to see through her at all. The 'village people' have known her for about 16 years, I've only lived here for 6 years. I'm liked, but I wouldn't be if I told the truth. Pretty sure everyone would do the famous 'But she's your mother!'

I keep hoping that she'll show her true colours with age, but she's 89 now so I don't think that's going to happen. I just have to hang in there.

I love what you did with your haters @tyme that's brilliant and encourages me that you had such a well deserved win.

You're not off track, it's lovely to interact with you and I'm grateful, thank you.

@DoriansDorterMy advice would be that I'm not sure that's an argument you can win. If someone thinks of your mother as a saint, then if you try to correct them then they may well just think you're jealous of her. You would need to go into so much detail to convince them that it's just not worth the emotional toll of doing so.

My own mother is manipulative as well, just not very good at it, so people know what she's like. But it recent years when I've talked to people about my issues and a lot of them stem back to my childhood, I don't go into many details of what she was like because I feel like they will think I'm a bad son and making stuff up or exaggerating.

I know that's all probably not very helpful. The only thing I can think of to suggest is that not trying to convince anyone of anything, just say "We have very different experiences of what she's like" or something like that and hope that in time, they see what she's like or begin to have doubts, remember what you said and may approach you for more information or just be more open to want to hear your side. This way n o one can ever accuse you of lying or of making anything up, so may be more open to listening to your side.

I'm sorry you have to deal with this, it's a horrible situation to be in and I know from experience that it can really affect you for the rest of your life. I concern myself more with just trying to work on myself now rather than worrying about appearing to be a 'good son' or expecting anything different from her. I just became to harmful to me to keep worrying about so I needed to just let it go. Not that that changes anything or make me feel much better, but I just had to do it to move past it and start to try to get myself in a better place mentally.

@DoriansDorterYes, the "how to cope with it" is the hardest bit to solve. I decided, for my own mental health, to distance myself from her as just dealing with her would trigger me. It's like she has a natural instinct of knowing exactly what to say to me that will flick a switch to make me so angry in an instant that it's hard to control and I need to leave before I give in to temptation and start an argument. Then recently, she had some serious medical issues and I was forced back into regular contact with her. I didn't want to, but how would I look if I didn't do all I could to help!?

The only way I've found to deal with it is to surround (if you can 'surround' yourself with only a couple of people) who know what she's like and how it has affected me and can support me, and just be on my side by understanding what I deal with. I really don't know what else I can do. You can them out of your life... you're bad! You try to explain to people... you're bad. You go on like before and try to ignore it... everyone is happy except you and the mental toll gets worse. So i try to always remind myself that none of it is my fault, I deserved better and despite growing up like that I turned into what I consider quite a respectful, generous and empathetic person. Maybe I have her to thank for that... who knows.

I guess if someone asks again "Has she always been like that?", you could answer "She's always been the same." or something like that. You're telling them the truth, you've just left it up to them to decide what that truth is. It's in the way your say it I guess to leave them with a bit of doubt as to exactly what you meant... sowing a seed in their mind possibly. I wish I had more advice on how to cope with it, but that's the true deviousness of that sort of manipulation... it doesn't leave you any real way to win. The people she has fooled don't spend anywhere near the time with her that you do and have so what chance do you have to convince them? The fact she even fooled your husband for so long, speaks for how good at it she is.

I think for me, recognising what hurts and pains me the most was important to move on from it as much as possible. That was how it has effect me throughout my life, my inability to trust people and form connections with anyone. So I stopped focusing on her and tried to focus on myself and trying to undo some of the damage and that is where having people around me that do understand helps so much. Like here, people don''t have to know about my mother to help me try and undo some of the damage so I continue to reach out and make connections with anyone who is willing to share their experiences which helps to remind me I don't have to feel so alone anymore.

So the next person that comes up to you saying what a saint your mother is, give a little "up for interpretation" comment if it makes you feel a little better (it does for me), but ultimately feel bad for them, because they've been badly manipulated and don't know it. Then walk away and remind yourself that you are not a fault, you are the one suffering and that you only want people around you that are supportive and can make you feel better and happier. That's all that matters at the end of the day. Feeling the way you do is only allowing that manipulation to continue.

It will always hurt, not just because some people don't see the truth, but because of that they're completely blind to how it has affected you all of these years. And for me anyway, that's the key thought that makes me want to focus on healing myself because I see it as the best way to ultimately reject as much of a lifetime of manipulation and attempted shaming as much as possible. Plus I think about how she must have had a lot of her own issues to be like that, so I refuse to be dragged down with her, feeling just as bad about myself.

Hey @DoriansDorter ,

How are you today?

To be honest, if she hasn't changed after 89 years, I'm kind of thinking she won't.

So what does this mean? It means you probably have to find ways to beat the feeling so you can be on top and come out on top.

There are some people you just can't change, and don't want to change. And that's okay because it's their choice. They probably end up burning all their bridges.

At the same time, I'm thinking that a Pollyanna attitude is beneficial for the person themselves in that they don't have to look at the other person and think about how horrible they are. I actually think it's not easy being a Pollyanna! I get what it can mean though! Toxic positivity!